Celtic Banter Archive August 30 2014

30 Aug 2014 19:21:03
Hi Ed, bhoys and ghirls, I know this is on everyone's mind . normally you here some rumours right up to deadline . we haven't heard anything really is this the way we do business now ( quietly ) or do you think there will be any new additions apart from scepovic . Or does it all hinge on who goes?
Celtic Always

30 Aug 2014 15:28:19
here ed hows you?still limpin aboot?
here a herd thit sellik huv goat a wee astra next a wundur wid ye talk tae pedro lawless tae see if its the wan thit a hud parked outside the sarry 4 nites ago?
its goat a blue color wae a white trim roon it,
blue lite oan the factory fittit sunroof,
wae a dug cage it the bak, loud speeker,
blood stains oan the seats, dd kit wae vomit oan the tube!(ah think his name wiz craigo white)
bit ah canae verify the mile age ae it iz it wiz turnt forward bae a very respectable member ae the pigs last week, reward fur its return fae wee timbo as per!
ps ye never seen me rite?
pps rite?
pps rid bull disnae gie ye wings iz big Sammy the sash screemed it me eftur jumpin aff the tower it ruchill hoaspittal last nite,
a servis wull be helt in his absence
he's concurrintly bein held in ward 2, 3 & 4 ae the suthurn gen awaitin pick up afore bein plantit in Springburn joab centre gerdins!
it wiz hiz wish, god blessum n let's hope he keeps a seat fur wee pat n' ed near the fire
oor croccy tears go out tae his only surviving relative" rab the stab" no the sharpist tool eh?
aw donashins tae wee pat it,
"wee pats plantin n' roasti directurds",
15 posso rd
posso, "creamashuns dun while ye wait!"
alsaenewly released spaces noo available it oor new plantashun it auchenhowie rd mulguy,
so how no die noo tae avoid the rush!
alsae barbicues dun tae bae appointmint tae?
jst in. "penalty boax spots jist been released!

Russian is not my strong point wee paht…can ED translate

the only thing I think I made out was that ED has a limp?

Top class paht tears in my eyes here with laughter excellent .lol

RUSSIAN a have tried slowing it right down and still cannot make "heid nor tail of it" lmao!

Let us in the translation please Tam ;-)

Brilliant, it's been a while!
No translation needed. Just read it properly :)

30 Aug 2014 14:03:07
Ed, in my view this would make for an interesting exercise

What is the turnover of the following clubs and looking at their starting eleven only, what is the "churn rate" and from that we can assess the average longevity of any particular player's stay at any one club.

Clubs in the same bracket at Celtic in this years ECL would be

Malmo
Olympiakos
Basle
Bayer Leverkusen
Ludogorets
Anderlecht
Apoel
Ajax
Schalke
Maribor
Sporting
BATE Borisov

I have left out CSKA, Zenit and Shakhtar Donetsk because they are generally owned by filthy rich oligarchs so balancing books would be a futile exercise.

So, what do we know? Well we know that certain teams from certain countries can sign non EU players at any age without having to meet the criteria that CFC have to meet (or clubs within UK) which revolves around national caps etc; so the Portuguese and Russians and Cypriots can sign very talented south americans at 21, 22, 23, 24 etc and so forth; CFC cannot (albeit I understand the "homegrown talent" logic of such a policy but it can be/has been a handicap of sorts recently)

To ascertain where we are, we need to look at these 12 clubs and the competitiveness of their leagues and their turnover/revenue and other factors like no. of homegrown players as a ratio to "international" signings and such like. Each team may have their own unique story to tell in terms of how they arrived at their current day destination (i.e. ECL qualification) and perhaps we could learn something.

If I have interpreted PL's Q&A correctly, he is suggesting that we are a selling club and that the KEY is to replace your top talent with emerging talent who will in turn become the next top talent. The issue with this policy however is 2-fold. For the purposes of continuity, you would require a player who becomes SUPER but who wants to stay for say 3 years of a 4 year contract or 2 years of a 3 year contract. One year will never be enough if continuity and Euro competitiveness is the AIM.

On the flip side, the PLC will often want to cash in without taking the risk of the "dripping roast" drying up which can happen with HOT players form dipping. so there is a balance to be struck there.

The other issue of course is finding ADEQUATE replacements. I believe that CFC strategy/policy has a degree of merit BUT we have had a poor run in terms of TALENT SPOTTING and value-adding investment recently whereby replacements have not come in and improved the starting eleven (or to put it more kindly, we have not plugged the holes left by quality departures). If this is the policy, then perhaps Celtic should take £1m out of the transfer kitty and invest wisely in 2 or 3 more scouts on £200,000 a year and allocate a £400,000 annual travel budget between them. If the policy is to uncover rough diamonds and buy a good number of them and train them to run harder, jump higher, pass better and develop technically, then logic tells me that we need to find the relevant and best qualified scouts to source these rough diamonds and the more the merrier.IE if 1 in 5 work out then sign 20.or bring them in on loan deals with options to buy. If they don't now how good they are or how good they could be, they won't cost the earth.

Interestingly, if it is a case that the plan is to find players and to improve them in all departments what becomes interesting is the ability to find these players with so many flaws and undeveloped parts of their game, IE what are the tell tale signs that they can in fact improve technically? IE we are not scouting players that can already jump higher and run faster and pass better as these same players in mediocre teams would inevitably have been spotted by other sharks.

If I were in PL's shoes I would adjust my strategy ever so slightly and raise the quality bar ever so slightly and insist that any top talent serves a minimum 2 full years (or seasons) before (contractually speaking) they are allowed to promote a move elsewhere (a 2 way street and a gamble "yes" because there will be circumstances where demand for a player is there and the price is right but it may only be month 16.and not month 24); there will inevitably have to be a degree of common sense flexibility but the focus will not be on cashing in at the expense of the team too quickly; IE the balance will be struck between continuity and cashing in to fight another day.

The last part of my rant is about Scottish football and the fickleness of the fans and the hangers-on. What are St Mirren, Kilmarnock, Motherwell, Inverness, St Johnstone, Hamilton, Ross County and Partick Thistle bringing to our league with crowds of 3,000 and travelling supports of 200-500? The national sport is a complete joke in terms of attendances. We need a renaissance of sorts and quickly! RFC going through administration number 2 would make for interesting reading but make no mistake it would be a nightmare for CFC in terms of "the on the park product" and over-arching "interest" in the national game. Our radio pundits do our game little favours either. What do they add? When do they encourage people to get out and back their team? The average gates exc. Celtic, Rangers, Hearts and Aberdeen are now on a part with England's lowest tier (not second lowest, but lowest) and not far ahead of Ireland!

Last point. Scotland has a population circa 1/10 of the UK. The EPL and the SPL had "products" to market and sell (onus also on english FA and scottish FA). The EPL have taken their game/product to europe, china, india, south east asia, north america and the like and enjoyed the spin offs commercially. What did the SPL do?

If we had 1/10th of the equivalent monies pouring in to England, things wouldn't be so bad but the latest TV deal dwarfed ours by 200:1 not 10:1.read this again .200:1 .

The blazers and the men behind the marketing and promotion of our game have failed miserably and CFC are caught up in that too . we are now in a league with no sponsor . and we are demanding last 16 of the ECL every year.

So you want three scouts on 200k per annum and 400k for expenses? Are you serious? I agree the identification of players has stalled, no need to name them we know who they are, but most transfers have a degree of risk.The simple fact is we over pay players who are playing in a poor league, run by people with no vision.

I think you make some interesting points paradise a think in terms of coaching / scouting by in large we get it right up until now mate

In terms of the allure of TV rights a think a few years ago we tried to "go alone" as a pairing (OLD FIRM) only for the rest of the league to take it to a vote and threaten to resign from it, I think the time we went with Setanta Sports really killed our negotiation / bargaining base when the SKY deal at the time was on the table so to speak only for Setanta to go belly up!

my understanding is that our business model was based on spending circa 5/6 mill a season on transfers trying to reach the CL stages AND if we don't reach that selling ONE player to "balance the books" when Rangers went down there was a FUSS as to how we would suffer PL very brazen said " CELTIC are not reliant on RANGERS our business model is STRONG! and a STRONG CELTIC does not need a Rangers to be successful" yesterday IMO he seemed to change that and it really irked me he said " we have lost more money than anyone else with the LOSS of RANGERS he (PL) cannot have it both ways IMO a suspect the "business model" has changed a further suspect that is why NL left! but for the purposes of doubt I don't MISS Rangers, I am not a hater by any means, I do not miss the BILE element, I did not enjoy the feeling before an old firm game that nervous / nauseating feeling you get before it ( I know am not the only 1 that feels that btw!)

If PL is now saying we need Rangers he owes it to us all to come and say just that and not "fudge/skirt" round the issue like a politician atvb jb7

Sorry a wanted to add to the first bit we get it right coaching / scouting from goalkeeper to middle its up front we get it badly wrong with strikers / creative types Ed has gave me enough of a "bashing" today so a better not ask for my "strikers coach" even though RD said he wants someone in to work on FINISHG

Hi Jamie

if it is about talent spotting and improving / polishing up rough diamonds then we need managers, assistant managers, 1st team coaches, reserve coaches and SCOUTS with specific talents to meet the over-arching corporate/commercial strategy.

You cannot have a strategy on the one hand and a lack of resource on the other in terms of maximising one's prospects of that same strategy succeeding. Green Jhedi, you have clearly missed that point …

On TV rights, we have missed the boat but there ought to have been some kind of retrospective investigation in to why the marketing of our national game floundered so badly …. the reason for retrospective audits is to ascertain cause (and effect…) and then to make sure when other initiatives are being pursued we are better prepared. IF TV and sponsorship is linked to PARTICIPATION (partly attendances) then we should have a nationwide policy aimed specifically at improving physical attendances (not helped by pundits who routinely complain and remark on our impoverished game). What if it is impoverished? Do we accept it or do we CORRECT it?

I agree with the business model synopsis Jamie, IE selling talent when ECL qualification doesn't happen to balance the books, but a blind man could see that no RFC would hamper league competition. Hearts and Hibernian out of our league hampers competition too. Hibs may have been poor but it was 2 away games that drew around 28,000 fans in aggregate (gone in a flash) that is £500,000 (and Hamilton don't make it up)

I too have experienced that nauseating feeling pre old firm matches, but I always hope that the match-up could stain its charm (without the bile on both sides) and become a spectacle once more. I worry that when we meet again, the game will be floundering to such an extent that it will fall to the same level of cumnock versus auchinleck in terms of ferocity and stupidness …let us hope not!

I believe we do need a strong Rangers or a club with a support that has parity with our own who want the same things as we do…we cannot both be champions and it will be a case of survival of the fittest ….competition is good in EVERY walk of life and unless Sir Ian Wood buys Aberdeen and pumps in £100m, or competition will always come from our City rivals….

Rangers have been poorly run and they are currently being supervised by a Board that couldn't spell "governance" and the board and management at RFC are all complicit; a BIG club with a BIG support that forgot how small it had become (in terms of the leagues they play in) and didn't take the slow boat back to "credibility" ….they have pursued a very odd signing policy and paid way over the top for their corporate structure and greedy men have bled them dry….

A self sustaining Rangers (without the parochialism and sectarianism) would be a welcome addition to our domestic competition Jamie …surely?

Could we not get Tony Cascarino in for striker coaching …he is definitely available …I'd do it for less than minimum wage Jamie!

Hi paradise, It is nice to see someone that adds substance to a point mate it really is!

I think Rangers are trading CURRENTLY insolvent I think they are as long a way off being "self sustaining" and I am delighted at that from my profession I believe they currently owe their previous beer supplier (that is POST sevco) circa 600k there attempt to put a "positive spin" on there change of supplier is being masked by that dominator! I could type a lot about Rangers and there plight but as a said before have no real desire to do so, I HOPE we do not need them, I do not miss them

I to have an opinion on TV revenue but it is a long shot I have previously aired but it involves SKY LOSING the EPL rights to BT / Virgin when the contract is up for grabs this year

I thought big Sutton would have made some Coach as he could also play himself in a few positions which is handy but a see big Pierre V Hooijdonk has got himself a post at the Dutch National Team he spotted Cifti @ Dundee Utd who is good and will know all the dutch talen that could be tapped into like the boy is it promises? who destroyed the under 21, like you a would do it just to "watch the grass grow" ATVB JB 7

30 Aug 2014 12:42:56
Hi Ed has stefan scepovic passed his medical and he's awaiting his work permit

{Ed007's Note - Yes.}

31 Aug 2014 09:16:36
Paper talk now seeing that he's holding out till deadline to see what other offers come in- hope PL has a 'Plan B'

30 Aug 2014 09:40:40
If all that was left with Scepovic, the what's the hold up? Any insight ed? Of course see that the English papers stating that Virgil has asked away, if true he's got a Cheka since he missed glaring chances on Tuesday, hasn't exactly been outstanding in Europe or domestically.

We'll I guess his departure will be dictated by the fat cats from the EPL and we'll be scrambling about at the last minute, again!

Let's hope the team show they deserve to wear the jersey tomorrow and get a performance and a result.

Hail Hail.

30 Aug 2014 09:55:37
If its true that VVD wants away then I'd like to see the Board say No!

He's only been here a year and has plenty time on his contract. I also don't think we'll get a decent fee for him anyway and could get more if he shows improvement in the Europa League and overall in the domestic competitions.

Mrs E

In years gone by I would have agreed with you but I would honestly sell him if the price is right. I remember Izzy and Kayal looking good in their first seasons and going down hill since then. I'm not saying that will happen with VVD but no point in keeping an unhappy player.

VVD is still the best player in the team by a country mile. I agree with Mrs E. The board have to say no to any transfer especially this late in the window. If VVD goes it means Ambrose will play most of the season at CB and my nerves just can't take that!

I know what your saying Niall but the squad is way too short on quality now to sell VVD. If he'd been here going into his 3rd season then fair enough.

Des, I'm the same and it would do the Club no harm with the fans if they were seen to be trying to keep our decent players.

Agree with you Mrs E that we are well short of quality but Denayer could replace VVD and that would be the only change from last years back 4 (although if I was celtic manager Ambrose wouldn't wear the hoops again after Tuesday).

I have just seen it too many times where an unhappy player can be poisonous for a dressing room and just when we needed our dressing room to regroup and come out fighting this clown turns his back on his teammates and the club who have given him the platform to push on? Unacceptable in my opinion.

30 Aug 2014 05:46:48
Enough PR .Do we owe cash? Are we paying dividends in place of lack negatively absorbed cash from our harder times? Tax breaks/repayment for archaic debt/ loan costs? I'm making excuses to vindifiy the modern day ironical Robert or locklesly, sir pedro. I am brought to a point of near apolexia trying to define this current movement.
Numbskull stuff out the way . The cutbacks have been unashamed and massive. There has to be a reason apart from the 'greed' of a board for what's happening. i'm at a loss.

Sauce passion incident (again).