30 Jul 2024 23:11:05
I understand some people are upset about the speed of transfers, and I am to an extent. But we need to realise that it's real life, and it isn't like we're playing FIFA. I'm sure Rodgers and the scouting team have had hundreds of players offered to them who are either worse or no better than what we have.
By moving into this new bracket of 'Champions League' calibre players, we have to be more patient. The players we have picked up over the years have been happy to come to us as we offer them exposure and a few European games; this doesn't excite these better-quality players; what they see are terrible weather, poor pitches and lower-quality teams. Players like Hugo Bueno and Michel-Ange Balikwisha can go to us or hold out all summer and get a move to teams like Salsburg or Atalanta, who will offer Europe better weather, better leagues and similar wages. Players have opportunities across Europe that may be better for them than what we can offer, and if they don't come, they'll look at us. It's a nightmare, but it's the reality of it.
People acting like the board is saving pennies at every moment need to realise that it isn't all about wages and transfer fees; what if the club don't want to sell for any price? What if they're going to move to a country that fits their lifestyle? What if the player's family don't want to go to Glasgow? A good example is Idah. From what we have seen, Norwich has been adamant that they do not want to sell; Idah has taken it into his own hands by not travelling, which further supports this view on the club's unwillingness to listen to him. But we have some people saying just, "Offer 8 million, offer 10 million", "pay what Norwich wants", "or we are cheapening out" It comes down to the club that owns the player. We will be saying the same for MOR. We don't want to sell, so why entertain any bids? We get upset when it's the same as others.
All we can do is listen to what Rodgers has said and have faith that the board will deliver. Up to now, the two keepers have been great business, and I'm more glad that all the leaks have gone quiet. Remember, the club is working towards a long-term vision, and we need to trust in that.
{Ed007's Note - This is far too sensible to be on here but welcome aboard mate ???
31 Jul 2024 01:13:56
Idah incoming. If it's true Atalanta have come in with £20 rising to 25 with add ons. I'd be very tempted. Especially if there is even a 20% sell on.
31 Jul 2024 04:47:27
If the club don’t want to sell or if the player doesn’t want to come then you move on. You can’t tell me no good players want to play for Celtic and clubs don’t want our money, some players might string you along but good scouting should highlight the likelihood of getting it across the line too.
I can’t believe we are still waiting on Idah, if Norwich won’t sell then we have to move on quickly, we’re starting the season with 1 striker and 1 left back, unreal.
31 Jul 2024 06:10:33
Wab obviously there are some good players that once given the opportunity will come and play for Celtic, more often than not most of them want to get away as soon as they are here for whatever reason and sometimes you get the odd one here and there that doesn't mind staying a bit longer because they fall in love with us and the club. It is just that in my opinion it is getting harder and harder to persuade people to come here, the Champions league carrot doesn't have the same value as it once did in my opinion. I mean who wants to sign for a team that gets pumped every time they play un the competition? Because of these reasons the board have a thankless task of trying to put it together, listen in no way am I a board apologist because I would really love for them to be a bit more brave and creative. They are very conservative board though and they have made the decision not to be reckless which I also understand. I don't believe for one minute that they don't enquire about players with a bit more quality I just believe that most of the time that what happened in the Eddie Howe situation where he strung us along all summer is most likely the kind of reasons as to why they find it much harder to bring the required players in hence the reason we tend to go for players that are a bit younger and sell them the stepping stone option.
The point I am trying to make is that even if we did start paying 50k a week would it have any impact? I'm sure it would have the impact everyone seems to think it would.
31 Jul 2024 06:20:13
TYPO ☝️
I'm not sure it would have the impact that many seem to think it would.
Also just wanted to say that someone posted a post recently about that if Celtic did raise the level of wages at the club the regardless of that cash sitting in the bank then there would be a real good chance that Celtic would become a business operating at a loss every year and it would most likely mean selling our a top player every season as opposed to every 2 or 3 seasons like we have now.
31 Jul 2024 07:02:53
Good post and correct that transfers have many moving parts. This doesn't really apply to Bernardo though. Selling club happy to sell, player happy to come to us, due diligence done, wages and fee known in advance. Delay is down to cash (fees, wage, addons) so this one lies with us. Player has now missed pre season and will be playing catch up for months.
31 Jul 2024 08:47:25
Sadly, the board don't have any good will among a significant portion of our support. This is a result of how they treated an element of our support and their performance in the last 2 transfer windows.
To many fans, this window looks similar to the January window, were if it had not been for Rodgers and a late agent call, we would have not got in a striker and. likely lost the league.
Therefore, the fans frustration, worry, anger and annoyance at this transfer window, is a direct result of the board. Hell mend them if they mess this window up.
31 Jul 2024 11:17:04
@Kyogoal - While it's important to acknowledge the complexities and challenges of football transfers, several issues with this viewpoint need addressing to understand the frustrations of many fans fully.
1. Pattern of Missed Opportunities:
While real-life transfers are indeed more complex than video games, this argument overlooks a recurring pattern of missed opportunities and late signings. The consistent failure to secure key players in a timely manner has had tangible negative effects on the team's performance, especially in crucial Champions League qualifiers. This isn't just about being patient; it's about recognising a history of delayed action that has cost the club significant revenue and success.
2. Strategic Planning and Proactivity:
The argument suggests that we need to be patient because attracting higher-calibre players is more challenging. However, this doesn't address the underlying issue of strategic planning and proactivity. A well-run club should anticipate these challenges and work diligently to mitigate them. This means identifying targets early, negotiating proactively, and ensuring that players are integrated into the squad well before critical fixtures. Fans' frustration stems from a perception that the board often reacts too late, rather than anticipating needs and acting accordingly.
3. Competitive Edge:
The assertion that players prefer clubs like Salzburg or Atalanta due to better weather, pitches, and leagues might be true, but it also highlights a need for Celtic to improve its own competitive edge. The club should leverage its strengths, such as a passionate fan base, a rich history, and the opportunity for players to become legends in a storied club. Effective communication of these advantages, combined with strategic investments in infrastructure and squad quality, can help counteract some of the perceived disadvantages.
4. Financial Misconceptions:
The viewpoint that the board isn't saving pennies overlooks the reality that fans often see evidence to the contrary. Historical reluctance to meet valuations for key targets, such as Steven Fletcher, has led to missed opportunities and a perception of penny-pinching. While some clubs may not want to sell, offering fair market value early in the window can often persuade them otherwise, or at least start meaningful negotiations. The frustration is not merely about spending money but about spending it wisely and decisively when needed.
5. Transparency and Communication:
While it's commendable that leaks have decreased, better communication from the board about their long-term vision and transfer strategies could alleviate some fan concerns. The lack of transparency can lead to mistrust and frustration, especially when results do not align with expectations. Fans need to feel that there is a coherent plan and that the board is committed to executing it effectively.
6. Examples of Mismanagement:
The argument references specific players like Idah, but this overlooks broader issues of managerial missteps, such as the appointment and prolonged tenure of Neil Lennon, which many fans believe cost the club the historic "10 in a row. " The recruitment failures during this period exemplify a broader trend of poor decision-making at critical moments.
In conclusion, while the complexities of the transfer market necessitate patience, there is substantial evidence that the board's approach has often been reactive rather than proactive, leading to missed opportunities and underachievement. Addressing these issues requires more than just patience; it necessitates strategic planning, effective communication, and a willingness to invest decisively to maintain and enhance Celtic's competitive standing.
31 Jul 2024 13:44:29
Despite many attempts nobody comes near the quality and accuracy of
Kyogogoal1888.
I look forward to more truth and honesty.
31 Jul 2024 14:09:31
@wee des you sound like a bot. Are you a bot?
31 Jul 2024 14:34:08
Wee Joe . Every one can repeat daily different tales to back up story . However repeating them doesn’t necessarily change from a point of view that can’t be proved correct. Nobody knows exactly what has transpired between Celtic Board and some other Board, people like yourself with an agenda can claim to have inside information, but that is usually SMSM inspired nonsense . If u believe that Celtic hadn’t done some work on Idah before Rodgers became involved, maybe u should believe in fairys. Name a manager that was available when N Lennon was appointed who had as good a record winning the SPL in the 10 yrs prior to his appointment. Many fans know that half the team wanted to move on they had been with Celtic quite a while . Board rightly refused them saying they had to stay for 10 in a row . Players said Celtic’s best ever supporter or so he called himself was allowed to leave previous year and they demanded to go . Players down tools, how was that NL ‘s fault . U are also aware of Sevco’s Covid party nights going unpunished . Aeroplane seating restrictions changed when Celtic were away and Celtic not informed . Rangers played covid rule breaking SFA hearing delayed until substitute was available to play .
31 Jul 2024 15:13:08
Des please could you tell me which part of my post your reply relates to?
The reason I ask is it made no sense in relation to my post.
I also suggest you refrain from the straw man argument as it is fallacious.
31 Jul 2024 19:17:50
What is a bot .
01 Aug 2024 02:27:31
Hi WeeJoe I thought I'd reply to your post
1/ 2: I agree that we have a pattern of missing out on players and often fail to get players in for crucial qualifiers and early league/ cup games, which has seen us crash out several times.
Going off of our current situation, Rodgers has mentioned numerous times that we have identified players, and he has sat with Nicholson to select targets. Suppose this happened 3/ 4 months before the season ended. In that case, I agree that we should have been negotiating targets and had them ready for the season starting at the weekend. But you assume the club hasn't identified targets early and is negotiating proactively. A good example is Bernardo; we have been negotiating for months for Bernardo, who was already at the club. Benfica wanted 6 million, which the club felt was too high; considering he has played 1,443 minutes this season (16 full games) and is valued as 2.9 million on transfermarkt, I completely agree that it is too high. Benfica can take as long as they want to hold off for a fee they want, then agents hold off for big fees, which is an even bigger issue as they often squeeze the deal for every penny, and then Bernardo has to agree with the wage. All of this for a player who was already at the club proves how long it can drag out when a player and a club have a specific value that is unrealistic. I would rather sit for an extra three weeks for a player if the club isn't overpaying. An example of being proactive is when we signed Hart and McCarthy; one paid off, and the other lost us huge amounts of money; taking our time for the right deal doesn't mean they are twiddling their thumbs.
3: Lifestyle, competitiveness, weather, etc., impact players' choice of move. It's held-up moves all over football, not just us; it's something that we can't change. The league needs to step up, and we can pray for the sun to come, but it is what it is. In terms of selling the club, I completely agree about how attractive we can make it. Still, when we take our Celtic glasses off, 99% of players look at money, weather and lifestyle over the legacy and history of clubs. Look at the world of football we are in; an example is Gabri Veiga, one of the hottest Spanish prospects ready to sign for Madrid with all their money, legacy, and prestige, who has chosen to move to Saudi Arabia. We are often beaten to players by Championship clubs who have way less to offer in terms of fans, prestige and history, but they have the potential of the Prem and can offer more money; it's just the reality.
4: I'm not disagreeing that we have cheaped out on players in the past. Steven Fletcher mentioned that the closest he ever came to joining was in 2020 before he signed for Stoke, which shows that maybe we didn't try to go for him as much as we thought.
The point of negotiations is to offer a price we feel is justifiable, and then we negotiate to a deal that suits both clubs; we often see a report that we have had a bid rejected, but that doesn't mean that we haven't already begun to negotiate more, look at Atalanta they've done that with MOR it's part of football. Look at Idah; his fair market value is £2.95 million. Transfermarkt said we had 4 million rejected, which is 1/ 3 higher than his value. Obviously, Norwich wants 11 million, which is 3.7x his fair market value price. When we have jumped the gun and offered large sums of money, it has come back to bite us; Simunovic was 5.5million, Rafael Scheidt for 5 million, which is equivalent to £10,944,342 in 2023, Ajeti was 5 million, Bernabei 3.75 million. It proves that when you don't follow the definition of negotiation, you leave yourself open to exploitation.
I couldn't agree more about the need for Transparency and Communication, which has been a significant issue for us. The board needs to be more open to discussion and fan input. At times, it feels like we're seen as a source of guaranteed cash, whether it's through new shirts that we don't even wear, increasing season book prices, or halting stadium upgrades. This lack of transparency extends to long-term aspirations and transfer updates, which we need more information about.
6: I used the example of Idah, as this is the main issue currently taking over the window. I agree with most that Lennon should not have been back to see out 10 in a row, and the transfer negligence has only further halted communication and transparency. But look at this season. We have a month left of the window, and we need 4-5 players in. All we can do is hope they meet Rodgers' expectations and get the players he wants.
I don't think Kyogo1888 is defending the board; he's trying to explain the transfer situation in a way that most people seem to identify with. You've made some great points, WeeJoe, but you've missed the point of the post pal.
01 Aug 2024 02:58:13
Let's just wait and see lads, plenty of time in the window, we should be strong enough to beat Killie at the weekend. I am hoping the board meet Brendans expectations, if we do then we should be a lot stronger for Europe and again we will dominate the league!
Hail Hail.