Celtic Banter Archive August 31 2014

 

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31 Aug 2014 23:53:29
The confidence is draining out of the club due to a lack of leadership and strategy from the very top.
The support realised we needed improvement after NL in terms of European ambition and trophies.

Lawell with his short list of 5-10 top candidates was a myth as was the ability to buy a £6m striker last year. The opportunity of CL football - after being given a second chance was treated with contempt.
The recent contradiction regarding 'not needing Rangers' to 'suffering more than any other club in the last three years' makes him look silly at least.
The new manager has lost the dressing room by showing favour to players clearly under performing and persevering with a system that the players have no confidence and willingness to apply.

We have no leader on the pitch - and have lacked an organiser and motivator for a while now - and I do not include Scott Brown as a leader.
The new manager is clearly under equipped to deal with the pressures/expectations of a club this size and the latest result and situation with Van Diijk will only add to the pressure he is under and this could have a further impact on dressing room moral.

The players; who obviously revelled in the 'flag day' against Dundee Utd have let themselves and the club down with their attitude and application in all the other games so far this season.
We are well aware of certain players limitations, but most of these guys are Internationals and should stroll through SPL games given their experience and understanding of what we fans expect every week?
With one day left in the transfer window it is blatantly obvious that the vast majority will stay, so we need to add a couple of real gems - which is unlikely - or get this squad to get their act together.

I was always willing to give RD a fair crack of the whip, but I worry that the back room staff that were appointed FOR him has created a rod for his own back as he seems to be short of ally's at present and the expertise and experience is somewhat lacking.
Could it be a case of the bland leading the bland?

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Best post in terms of fair / balanced even correct I have seen on this to date JJ

Nice one

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I agree and it looks like JC is licking his lips waiting on RD to go he has(JC) not once been animated in the dug out just sits there waiting, full thing is just one big farce

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01 Sep 2014 09:41:43
Junglejim you are spot on perfect post. Well done loved it.

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Tony2bhoy that was my next point about JC mate totally non-animated yet when the 3rd goal went in against united he was oot dayin cartwheels as though he invented the wheel!

Cant see him get it though if they did punt RD, and he can take his jumbo size mirror with him!

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31 Aug 2014 22:52:40
Hi Ed, How does the coefficient work now we are in the Europa do we gain less points for wins than we would in CL?

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{Ed007's Note - UEFA Champions League points system:

First qualifying round elimination – 0.5 points
Second qualifying round elimination – 1 point
Group stage participation – 4 points
Win in group stage or subsequent round – 2 points
Draw in group stage or subsequent round – 1 point
Round of 16 participation – 4 points

Clubs are awarded an additional point if they reach the round of 16, quarter-finals, semi-finals or final.

UEFA Europa League points system:

First qualifying round elimination – 0.25 points
Second qualifying round elimination – 0.5 points
Third qualifying round elimination – 1 point
Play-off elimination – 1.5 points
Win in group stage or subsequent round – 2 points
Draw in group stage or subsequent round – 1 point.

Clubs who are eliminated at the Play-Off Round are awarded 1.5 points and clubs are also guaranteed a minimum of two points if they reach the group stage and are then awarded an additional point if they get to the quarter-finals, semi-finals or final.

Could do us good in the long run if we had a decent tournament although need others to pull their finger out. Are we miles off making a difference to the CL qualifying as to what round we enter?

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31 Aug 2014 21:59:20
as I stated last week time for the board to back the manager and get rid of dead wood and get his players in or sack the manager and get someone in who can motivate the junk we have at present.

This can't be allowed to continue unacceptable performances a celtic team playing with one man up front against teams in this league not one player willing to hold possession of the ball either down to lack of confidence or being instructed to move possession on. I still think Ki was a player that should never had left the club as he could actually play and was brave in possession and always kept the play moving when needed glad I have not renewed my season book as I would be unable to make sunday matches due to Europa league fixtures.

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The problem is too big for anyone player to make a difference .

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31 Aug 2014 21:57:58
Regardless of how bad we may be at the moment I would tell scepovic to sign or do one. Looks like he may be hanging on for any offer than ours! Hardly the type of guy you want to dig you out a whole? And we might just be in a whole!

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31 Aug 2014 21:54:16
Just think Bhoys! Life isn't that bad we could be Real Madrid or Man United both spent over 100 million and both are rubbish! Watched Man United yesterday they are very poor and just watch Real Madrid tonight they got beat 4-2 by a team who struggled to beat Aberdeen!

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Even Bayern have started pish :)

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Real Madrid cost me £600 notes :-(!

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Jamie

I had sociedad 4 madrid 2 correct score

I've just bought out the easdales

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Did you get change out of your fiver from the Easdales paradise?

If so jump in a taxi hame mate with your winnings don't give them it back via bus fares lol :-)

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31 Aug 2014 21:07:42
I have read all of the comments and would wish to provide a different perspective.

RD saying that VVD was going nowhere was absolutely definitely an attempt by RD (and PL indirectly) to exhibit a show of strength, IE we are financially resolute and we are building a team. RD could not have been clearer. The WGS comment (suggesting RD was being naive) was below the belt too because WGS effectively said if someone paid twice over the odds he would be sold.well I'd take £20m and I am sure RD would embrace that too. so it was a mute point.

RD going to the fans may have been a little premature but can we maybe not give him the benefit of the doubt here? Was he not saying that there is solidarity between the fans and RD, IE RD knows what we want and he is suffering with us and he wants success every bit as much as we do? I am jot saying that this will happen for RD (IE success) but criticism of him for doing this was a little unfair. He was aware of criticism about fans outrage at watching a 2nd string at Inverness and their outrage at exiting to Maribor and wanted to show his appreciation for the fans packing the stand behind the goal (PS, fans response was extremely civilised verging on excitable and the fans deserve credit for that!)

RD does not want to be appear "distant" and detached and so I can well understand why he did that this afternoon.

This is a more complex point I am about to make. If the players are reluctant to tow the line and change their ways for the good of themselves (as professionals) then yes there is a problem. Disgruntled, half-hearted players CAN and frequently DO get managers the sack but this is the crucial point. Is that acceptable? Players are professional and managers are entitled to demand different things. Fellow Bhoys and Ghirls, can we just remember for a minute that a lot of these players are on between £8,000 to £16,000 per week and some closer to £20,000. They are supposed to be professionals and professionals adapt. Now the Club (PLC) will obviously be concerned if the dressing room (or part there) has been "lost" but before we get rid of RD with his expert philosophies and modern-day approaches, someone somewhere has to look at WHY the dressing room has been lost and if a hard core of 1st team (and outspoken) squad players have decided to let RD hang out to dry (as opposed to getting with the programme) then the right thing to do is NOT to get rid of RD or the primary culprits (tempting as it is). There needs to be a discrete investigation in to why it is happening. Now let us be unequivocal here. Every player should want to be curious. Every player should want to improve. Every player should want to adapt (and shouldn't need to be asked) and any professional worth their salt will understand that this is not about having an easy life or being indifferent to "new ways of working". In every workplace it is happening. RD has highlighted that many players have no clue how to play in 2s and 3s, IE too many players can make a pass but don't have an awareness in terms of what to do next (IE how to go and support) and the player receiving the pass, doesn't necessarily know how to move the ball on again effectively. RD said that players KNOW how to play their position (worryingly!) but that the majority did not now how to go on and make their colleagues job that little bit easier by running in to space or taking away opposition players. I agree with RD there.

As Celtic fans we also have a responsibility. CFC were not terribly good today but some of the reactions of late have been hysterical. As others have posted, this is not championship manager 2014 where you can press the reset button and start all over. This is real life.

If the strategy of buying cheap and selling for 4 times the price has come a cropper and if the monetary situation in the future looks a little it bleaker, then perhaps there is a "changing of the guard". What if RD is cheap? What if he does in fact know a thing or two about developing a player? What if the future involved developing more players? What level of tolerance would we as Celtic fans exhibit? The ICT away game resulted in many (including myself) getting stuck in to fringe players (and young players) who had hardly kicked a ball in anger all season and yet we expect them to come in and blow the opposition away with silky football! Hardly! I will hold my hand up, I am not sure if I could watch a young emerging talent get more wrong than right over a 10 game spell to have him come out the other end better for the experience? I am ashamed to admit it. If RD saw something in a 17 year old and said "right son, go and play and play without fear, and mistakes are a "nothing", make them, learn from them and make a name for yourself".would we make it easier? What role as fans would we be playing?

There is always 2 sides to a coin. We are all agreed that RD talks a good game. He did take a very small provincial club to the summit of Norwegian football. Some will cry "and what about it, it's Norway". Well he could only beat what was in front of him and he did it the hard way (he didn't/couldn't buy his way to the championship). I am not saying that RD is the answer but I think as CFC fans we need to (at the very least) give him some time. It may prove to be a disaster but let's make sure we are not complicit in the disaster unfolding.

If the players are going after the kill with a "death by 1000 cuts" strategy via performances that are lacklustre with intentional dereliction of duties, then we should use this forum to vent our fury and back the manager. It is RD's job to get the best out of them but you can have MASS MUTINY in the early days and then some wise up and decide that there perhaps is some method in the apparent madness.

As a "person" there is a lot to like about RD. He is paid substantially less than a number of our players. Let us give RD the benefit of the doubt until Christmas.

Well done to Dundee today (energetic, organised and threatening) and a belated well done to ICT. We want competitiveness and if competitiveness is to reign as a consequence of the Bhoys in transition then we might (just might) appreciate the good things and the goals that little bit more when they go in; not such a bad thing!

I am backing RD and no matter how frustrated I get in the next few weeks I will refrain from deriding RD; he deserves that and for those who feel he doesn't, then you should reflect on what level of disruption you'd be prepared to put up with for medium to long term progress.

just an opinion

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Hi paradise, I think the Scandinavian boys in lustig, johansen are trOying McGregor too, the rest you could through a blanket over IMO

I think the change in diet, harder training in JC they just don't fancy it IMO

Over the years a have supported the Archdeacon's, McNulty's, Sheperd's, Rogan's .McGuigan's even the Biggins & Muggleton's of our team but what we are witnessing is AWFUL,

Please enlighten me in the nicest sense to " a chink of light" "a glimmer" a foundation or a start to bulid on because I cannot see it myself,

There is no team spirit, no fight, no verve, no direction, no leader, no real shape!

The games am witnessing recently we are creating no more than 5! chances a game!

A don't have a solution! but we are going backwards fast and something has to be done to stop this dire drivel erosion we are seeing!

I never wanted LG sacked after his escapade! I never wanted Bitton sacked after his stance in the middle east, how dare anyone ask/seek someone to lose any livelihood!

But sometimes you are the wrong man in the wrong place at the wrong time, sometimes you got to hold your hands up and say this is not for me, or this is more than I expected, more than I bargained for It has happened to us all

But right now he looks out of his depth or comfort zone and am not the only one on here that thinks that!

ATVB JB7

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Paradise, an eloquent post in defence of our beleaguered manager and a lot of what you say makes sense. in a perfect world. Like all Celtic supporters we know that the 'real' world does not afford a Celtic manager no matter how inexperienced, the luxury of mistakes, especially when the tribute act across the city are not in the short term equation.

Not winning the league, And allowing young players to make mistakes over a ten game period is not an option available to us. I agree that it might, long term benefit the individual and consequently the team, but that will never happen. The only thing RD will be judged on is winning the league EACH and EVER season over the next three years and a cup or two to add to this bare minimum requirement would not go amiss.

The performances under RD to this point are far from acceptable for our club. I accept your point that he may be a fall guy in the opera orchestrated by the board, but unfortunately this is where we are at.

Well thought out post but RE 'ain't in Kansas anymore'

HH

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Jamie

I was/am with you but I am hoping that this is transition, adjustment, feeling-out, finding out, exploratory ….

IF IF IF IF IF …. we do not need everything fixed right away…


what did you make of the point about…how long would you give a youngster with potential …2…3.4.5.6.7.8.9…games …how many mistakes …rank decisions…naivety would you endure IF IF IF it lead to a more polished performer….

How can CFC progress without breaking eggs and at least piloting different approaches….

there is nothing RD has said that I disagree with (other than the point about defending never cost us!)

the other key point is that IF we are watching damn awful performances because there is something of a mini mutiny in the camp as "professionals" resist regime change and a raising of the "athleticism bar" …what to make of it ….

I am not saying this is happening but just say Jamie (for arguments sake) that you did have an insight in the bowels of the dressing room and you found out that there was something unworthy of CFC going in (IE players undermining management), what would you do….

RD did little wrong today in terms of team selection

the worry for me is the fact that the players are falling like flies …this can happen when there is mutiny .

matthews is becoming softer than big Derk….

anyway, my original post was let us take a closer look at players who should know better …there was a lot of drivel today and RD cannot kick the actual ball….

everyone (who tries their heart out) deserves a little time to get it right; the focus on RD at the moment (personally) is misguided (but just my opinion)…what about a wee look at the players ….

even for (say) 3 weeks ….we mind find out a lot Jamie

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ROFL at "we ain't in Kansas anymore"

but last year we hadn't heard of "clyde gateway boulevard" either!

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Jim Dhoc we need to give him a couple of months …

we below dundee united away and there was little grumbling that day …

RD is having to deal with unsettled players and an injury list that would choke a horse

we can forgive ICT (weird team selection)

we beat St J
we thumped Dundee Utd

Today at Dens we had half a team coming off the back of a morale damaging ECL exit (no Forrest, Brown, Lustig, VVD, Matthews, Mulgrew, (no Tonev, Wakuso) and the rumour of in-house unrest

Maribor got too much respect at home (mistake) but we still need to see if he can learn very fast

what have we got to lose in the context of this season …really?

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Hello Again paradise, A lot on here would love youth to get a run mate after the 4-1 defeat in Poland a said if RD "had a pair" he would send out the youth even in defiance and a got panned for it

A think there is a real few that could get a game and should be around the1st team them being Jackson Irvine (who can play in more than one position) the goalie Fasan looks FAB tbh (ex goalie me!) I think we would ALL except youth making mistakes am looking for a bit of fight, heart, just to be in the contest the now mate would be a start!

A think if we could the boy Rogic fit he could be a STAR ( a say this because I know how well my uncle rates him, he trained him in Oz! ) Tim Cahill who can play a bit said he was "head n shoulders" above anything else emerging!

At this point I could say they couldn't do any worse but we need more than that now mate the thing I do not get is we destroyed Utd, we dropped the entire team to play ICT and were told it was with Maribor in mind so I think am right in saying we were all waiting on the team that played Utd to play against Maribor and well it was bizarre mate!

Am no here mate to say Xmas or give him the Jan window

A think if him and PL stop giving us the "Mushroom Diet" we have been getting lately you know (kept in the dark and fed Chite!) tell us the "template" our "new business model" stop fkin telling us what we are not getting or how poor we are or we are delusional! we can see it we are grown men ffs! but then we can judge them and even then HUNT them if they fall way below that! ATVB paradise

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I don't think that it's the substance of what R D is saying that is the problem
Rather it is the way he is delivering it.
He comes across as been arrogant knows it all and our professionals don't like been treated as inferiors .

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{Ed007's Note - Jesus wept!!! We've just got rid of NL and you're saying RD is arrogant - what colour's the sky in your world? Have you ever watched The Wizard of Oz with the sound down and Dark Side of the Moon playing instead? That's the kind of stuff we done back in the day when Orange Sunshine was our 'tipple' of choice.
If our professional players don't like doing what they're told they can go, weren't you one of the posters championing JC's appointment and saying players would just need to like it or lump it?}

01 Sep 2014 09:36:10
Jamiebhoy talks a lot of sense here Paradise. We are all ( me included) judging RD on what we think we know, and we know nothing in the scheme of things. Issue however is Ronnie needs to think about what he says. he continues to contridict himself. Your point Paradise is correct as well. Lawell should understand that the strategy does not work. If he wants Ronnie to build anything Lawell can't keep selling the best players. All we will be left with are players who no one wants to buy so we will need to run down their contracts or release them but we don't have £60 mill to buy a new team so this selling off the best and keeping the rest was always going to bite us in the a**e sooner than later. Lawell needs to go back to the drawing board. Now if there is an issue in the dressing room Lawell should stand up and say that if anyone is unhappy then go and find a new club because Ronnie Dalia is staying and this is our new blueprint. Then tell us what we are trying to do, however Lawell is never going to tell us because he does not know himself and whilst he has appointed RD he is never going to take the flak if he does not work out. Ronnie can only play one way. We don't have the players who can play this system and the Board have not gone out to get those types of players in so we are in a mess and Ronnie as manager is going to catch the flak, before players and before the Board. It will be interesting when Broknie comes back as to what he comes out with. He has been very quiet recently?

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31 Aug 2014 20:39:04
I think anyone we get in tomorrow apart from scepovic ( if it happens ) will be not a panic buy but someone who is well down the pecking order of our scouts we have been on here for weeks knowing we need strengthening in many areas and believe me so does rd and pl so any players we have went for up till now must not be interested, now it's the last day of the transfer window and let's be honest we could do with about six players!! Does anyone on here honestly hand on heart think our board are prepared to shell out millions to bring in some good talent tomorrow I for one think at most we will get 1 maybe two signings tomorrow and maybe 2 in the opposite direction, this could be a really bad year for us people!

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I too hope for some signings, but I also hope it isn't too long before Scott Brown is fit again.
He seems to be the only player in this squad with any leadership qualities

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Tam, I think Deila has destroyed enough players at Celtic without giving him another six players to destroy . I think the only player that he has inherited that is reaching anywhere near the standard of last season is Kayal . The team is regressing game by game .

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Yourman…

"destroying players" …. come on …RD is not destroying anyone …

system unproven
sporadic team selections
lack of hunger and appetite
no leadership minus Brown
commons in contract stand off
VVD wanting away
an unpredictable injury list

lets be a little more impartial for the sake of fairness

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31 Aug 2014 20:33:59
I'm getting a bit worried that if stefan scepovic rejects celtic we haven't got a plan b . I'm not joking when I say this I fear for celtic attacking wise because anthony stokes is not the answer and even leigh griffiths isn't a tall forward and now we have width we have no tall frontman to knock them in. fingers crossed he signs or something happens tomorrow

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Chalky what I want to know is.what the f**k is going on at our club? i'm starting to get really worried something is not right

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31 Aug 2014 20:12:25
Although i'm far from happy from performances of this current Celtic team apart from Craig gordon, denya, McGregor and somewhat commons we seem to have the exact same problems as man United although they have brought in world class for there manager and players new systems new techniques new life styles but needs time i'm all for this new change and wish everyone would get behind rd because what he says makes a lot of sence once his players are in and all the deadwood is out! we might see a better product saying that who would want Ambrose, kayal, izzy, stokes, mulgrew if they 5 go tomorrow I'll be one happy bhoy but can we replace them

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Getting rid of the list of players may be the easiest part but bringing in new that play better would be a lot harder .
Deila's formation is wide open for managers to counter . Full backs left without cover are easy targets to be beaten . United have spent big but also have got worse £60m for a player who neither made a tackle or hit a shot doesn't look as he will set the heather alight .

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31 Aug 2014 19:22:37
It's all simple politics is alive and very well at cp, Lawell has got his bounce factor head on, vvd is going like any other fu""ing guy through the door that's been half decent for us, he will make rd look like at c"nt we like thick persons he takes us for will be two busy either blaming rd or dreaming of some bullsh"t name dreamt up from the spin doctors inside cp, are club is being striped in front of every one of us and we are doing nothing, we were all quick in telling that joke across Glasgow how they should go around sorting ther club out, Celtic have made a very very lot of money over the last four years and I have no doubt this board will keep taking as long as we let them, let me put this one scenario to yous rangers come up next year they get a backer they have no debt so some mug puts let's say 20 million in to them they get rid of Sally Get a half decent manger in, they could win the premiership in ther first year back Now it's a nightmare scenario but not impossible and the way are club is being treated very likely if they get some money, dermot Desmond will go down in history in the same category as the Kelly's lawell is ther to make money hired by Desmond to make money for Desmond I hate to say it but I don't think he will give up his golden goose without a fight, like it or not ther is only one way in my mind we have to boycott untill the price for the club comes down rock bottom the we buy the club I have 1400 pounds worth of shares in Celtic and am willing to give them to any organized fan takeover bid, sounds bad but in 2 to 3 years time this is where I see Celtic if we don't do nothing about it now, we are too big of a club, with in my eyes the greatest fans in the world, with a board that is willing to accept second best for are club every time, well it's time to go Desmond take your tight shut wallet and go and look for a golden goose elsewhere and let Celtic go forward because your bad for something I love so much

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Well said mate! Spot on

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31 Aug 2014 17:37:20
Ed do you see it being a busy 24 hours for us transfer wise? Boths ins and outs?

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{Ed007's Note - I think there will be business done with both.}

More than one in do you reckon?

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{Ed007's Note - Oh gee - the pressure! I'll have a wild guess that at least 2 will come in (cue Pedro locking up CP at 5 and going home, turning on his heated driveway and hiding under the bed).

31 Aug 2014 15:07:32
Ed
Has Scepovic actually signed for us or is there a chance it still won't happen. I know rumours are sometimes meaningless but do you think he is still hedging his bets on a better offer coming his way? Let's be honest, he won't be looking at CFC with much excitement at the moment.

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{Ed007's Note - I was told yesterday that everything was done and dusted but it's looking like although everything has been agreed it hasn't been finalised. PSV and Deportivo de La Caruna have both shown interest in Scepovic.]

I don't think it is going to happen ed. I've had a bad feeling about it since the beginning. Any keen player would have signed before now and a really keen club would have made it happen before now.

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{Ed007's Note - I'm just hoping that we have an adequate back-up plan, I'm pig sick of players and their scumbag agents using us to drum up interest.}

31 Aug 2014 18:27:46
Any word on scepovic or anyone comin in? That was woeful again
Today! Commons looks like he really doesn't want to be here! And again ambrose and izzy were shockin! Can't believe we're no lookin to bring another left back in! It's going to be a long season if this is what we're stuck with! Don't know what to think anymore by the way!

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A L B won't solve many problems on that side of our team . Izzy has been out numbered on that side of the pitch and isn't getting protection due to the formation used by Deila .

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31 Aug 2014 18:21:00
We need new faces pronto, this squad can't hack it. We have no nucleus, nothing to build on or build around. No creativity, no leaders on the park, no spirit. The opposition have sussed us, expect teams to have a real go at us. Our best player at the moment is the goalkeeper! Looking further ahead, winning the league in 2015/16 is no foregone conclusion. We thought we'd be miles ahead but it's not panned out that way. I'm stunned at the way things have gone recently and I honestly can't see us turning it around with this team.

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31 Aug 2014 20:05:55
Hi ed, fellow celts,been following for a while,time 2 join the fun,with regards 2 celticflames comments bout creativity,passing etc,just like 2 no wot exactly is jim mc gunniness doing wi the first team, watched his donegal team (underdogs) destroy dublin in the galeic football 2day with Fight,passion,spirit and fitness that would put out first team to shame,and they are not professionals,Any thoughts??

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Too true, the amateur GAA players from Donegal showed the " professional set - up that Dublin have that a superb tactical plan played with heart and guts is unbeatable . In 3 weeks the All Ireland will be over, hopefully Ronnie and John give the Donegal man the floor .

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31 Aug 2014 17:02:06
hows this for a scenario!?probably way off the mark but I remember henrik larsson being quoted in the paper he was staying with falkenburg until his contract expires in november!im going to make a crazy prediction that deila will be punted in november and henrik will replace him.wont cost much to punt deila maybe the method in the madness!?

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Jones, as much as I don't actually agree with you.I could EASILY see it happen. In my humble opinion Henrik is no more qualified than RD, so if he gets the job I for one won't be jumping thru hoops!.(see what I did there ;)

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Jones you trying to get me into trouble pal lmfao?

A said on here at the time that PL picked RD (full knowledge as the cheap option!) knowing he had the King on the back burner in November and PL got his get out jail free card by "appeasing the masses"

Now now Ed you need to pipe up here mate because a took pelters for it lol?

ATVB JB7

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I cannae see wrongy delia lasting ill nov, unless he can get a job at the superstore.

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If it does go wrong and the manager is replaced and we decide to go for another young and up coming replacement I think Hartley would be worth a shout. Better understanding of the Scottish game and after todays game its clear his players know their task and which direction the opposition goal is in. to be fair I was hoping the gaffer would do great but after each game I'm less confident.

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Hartley would have the right formations and the players would give him all.
I am sorry Larsson was a football playing God, but so far he hasn't achieved much as a manager .

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Haha I can see this happening m8, I'm not saying that henrik would be my ideal appointment just remembered larsson saying he's done in November and I just wouldn't put it past us to have this sewn up cause larsson did officially turn us down saying he's not ready yet.November maybe??

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31 Aug 2014 15:58:09
I know this may sound a bit like a conspiracy theory, but listening to PL and his comments in the press, is it possible that we are being held back deliberately in the hope that if the dead ones return Scottish football may appear more competitive. In reality, we should be sitting on the horizon and just about ready to disappear out of sight, in domestic terms at least, unless there is another agenda. A bit far fetched maybe but we have all witnessed how the Scottish football authorities and the forces of darkness work!

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31 Aug 2014 16:34:20
Ridiculous if lawell wanted to sign people then he would I don't know how u can blame scottish authorities!weird post

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31 Aug 2014 16:57:13
It was meant to be ridiculous, but so are the statements from a CE bemoaning the lack of finance available when he had TWO chances of £15million plus and did nothing to make damn sure we got it!!

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31 Aug 2014 17:08:33
Chasaboy if you want a conspiracy theory check this out. Ronnie is told VVD is going nowhere. He comes out with it. Tomorrow Lawell sells him. RD looks bad yet again throws in the towel walks away as he is made to look a mug? OK maybe the walking away is just wishful thinking on my part but I do think VVD is going tomorrow!

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31 Aug 2014 18:00:31
Johnnymac, believe it or not, the same thing crossed my mind the minute RD said it, his position as manager would become untenable and would he want to work for a CE that did that to him. Wee GS did point out that it was a silly thing for RD to say. On my original post, it was meant as a bit tongue in cheek, but as history has shown us, the people who run our game do ridiculous things with ridiculousi regularity. Did they not pay a TV company to show a certain clubs games?

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31 Aug 2014 18:32:55
Just had another thought, did RD say it to challenge PL, interesting day tomorrow

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31 Aug 2014 19:13:01
Who knows Chasaboy? Let's see what happens tomorrow. What was RD promised when he arrived? It's obvious he has not seen Mubarak or any signing play. They have confirmed that. The loan signing issue is a strange one. If it's a loan for the young lad at Man City where they want him to get games I can see that, however most players apart from the young ones (under 21) are usually loaned out because they can't make it. So a loan player from a top club might be a decent player but when you get Berget, Tovey and Mubarak who are 24 and can't get a game it worries me. We will wait and see but I don't think RD was expecting this just look at his comments on loan players?

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31 Aug 2014 15:54:17
Keep thinking Armstrong would walk into this celtic team I know he is injured but I would still take him no probs we have no legs going forward.please surprise us tomorrow with a couple of signings

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You might get your wish chalky when RD was pressed at the news conference afterwards was happy to speak about LG, VVD and Scepovic when pressed on Armstrong it was the old "no comment"

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31 Aug 2014 15:53:31
Are you all fed up with Lawwell's attempts to blame fans with comments like "we cannot spend, spend spend" NOBODY asked for that but what we did ask for was a squad ready for the 3 CL qualifiers. The board knew these were happening so any new players bought or loans should have been in squad BEFORE these qualifiers, what is the point of bringing in 4/5 new players now?
It is the poor planning I and and I sure most Celtic fans are unhappy with, if we had Scepovic, Tonev, Mubarak and Denayer all in place a month ago the fans would have been happier as at least an attempt was being made to strenghten the team when it most needed it.

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31 Aug 2014 15:42:50
If this is the mince we are left with after tomorrow night?
Then it's going to be along season ahead!
If Deila can't or won't change the system then his ideas of attacking football is miles off what mine is!
We must also build from the back, surely somebody in that dug out who is being paid to do a job can see every team we play is able to pick holes right through our midfeild to defence.
It's not kids football, I can't be bothered with this " as long as we score more than them, it doesn't matter how many we concede"
Especially playing 1 up lol. And "that system"
Never mind, it can't get any worse eh?

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Never seen a Celtic side look so nervous on the ball and were lucky to a point. How long will we have to put with Ambrose? The guy is a total nightmare and I can't believe he is going to play another season. Stokes is another who should be shown the door and Adam Matthews is a shadow of the player we signed a few years ago. BBJ your right, its going to be a very long season!

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31 Aug 2014 15:30:23
Interested to hear peoples opinion on a wee scenario i'm beginning to think is happening:

Scepovic transfer is a PR stunt aimed at creating the illusion he will be signed as a replacement for Griffiths.

Berget has all along been the actual replacement.

Celtic were hoping to sell griffiths to raise funds but now are reluctantly willing to loan griffiths out

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What sort of a PR stunt though. People are hardly going to be running to buy season tickets because we're signing Scepovic. I think we just constantly get fed scheidt. PL this week that all the money is being reinvested. Pull the other one. Replacements have cost a fraction of the fee received for those that have gone and wages are being reduced.

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Not sure about berget/griffiths thing but starting to think the scepovic might be pr stunt, shouldve got may from st jonstone this year and russell last yr imo

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DN30 a really don't know pal this Scepovic transfer am trying to "rack my brain here " I cannot think of another transfer that has taken so long? even this "medical in paris" we have a good working Relationship with Ross Hall so that makes me think they have sent him to some specialist in Paris before parting with there cash it doesn't make sense! But having said that a think the deal is done if he sells VVD or Griffiths moves now he is going to look even worse mate atvb

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Just a stunt along the lines of giving the impression club are spending money.

Defo should of got may and russell. Far better than what we have got

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31 Aug 2014 14:47:54
God I could listen to Big Sutton all day long

Celtic fans are" REASONABLE "

It is REASONABLE to think Celtic SHOULD be beating LEGIA, Celtic Should beat MARIBOR"

"THIS IS NO WORK-IN-PROGRESS THIS IS CELTIC"

And on Griffiths going to Hibs


"It's not on SEND BERGET to HIBS!"

Tomorrow's Headlines is RD losing it already with his GESTURE watch this space!

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Mate after todays shamble, i'm beginning to think I got it wrong big time backing Delia. What sealed it for me was selecting Ambrose again.

lawwell has a lot to answer for! Constant stream of lies are being fed to us the supporters and its time to stand up and unite and get lawwell and desmond out!

Im going to hazard a guess as to why no player has been signed and suggest we perhaps are not in as good shape as we are led to believe or sheer greed at club.

Its our f**king club! Our love for celtic has been passed down generations and at moment we are sitting back letting them get away with it!

ACTION MUST BE TAKEN IMMEDIATELY!

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I actually don't know what to say about this!

I can make no sense of it at all.

I'm definitely back to Ronny's like a rabbit caught in the headlights.

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I don't mean about anyone's post just the overall performances by Celtic - if you can call them that!

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Mrs E I was all for backing Delia, but after today i'm seriously concerned about the direction club is going.

Ambrose should of been nowhere near line up. Griffiths is our best striker at moment, he should of started today and against maribor ahead of stokes.

Il hold my hands up and admit to being one of the first to slate lennons team selections. i'm beginning to think Delia is just as bad perhaps worse

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Hi Mrs E, a really don't know of anyone on here that wasn't willing to give RD chance even the ones that said who the hell is he?! were shot down with well we said that about Wim Jansen!

But his actions / selections we are beyond the realms of a couple here am afraid

There no fight, no leader, no strength or even depth, there is blame lines that lie for PL and the board but it seems a contest now between the two of them to see who can make the biggest meal of it!

If it is all "business model" stuff at worst a business does is "stagnate" and fail to move forward we are going backwards "rapidly" and a business that doesthat suffers big time! atvb

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Agree with both over team selections and tactics, seems Pub league stuff.

For all we loved/disliked Neil Lennon, he seemed to trust his players. I haven't seen that at all since he left. There's no confidence at all.

Ronny c'mon - prove us all wrong :-)

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@DN are you wishing Lennon was manager still? I did say to you be careful what you wish for and don't be fooled by his talk.If Lennon was guilty of not havin a plan B, then my concern is RD doesn't have a plan A.
A managers job is simple, just get the best out of what you have. never mind all this buulshhit about progressive football and playing in a certain way, just get results.God he can't even get the best out of johannsen and Berget and he already knows them, combined with making the current players worse, not exactly good management.

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{Ed007's Note - Blame Deila if you want but this is the impact of long term neglect, not a short term shambles. Since RFC were liquidated CFC have received £40,550,000 in transfer fees and spent £14,600,000 over the same period .
Pedro's talk of £10 million black-holes since their demise is a lie, a bare-faced lie, where is it in the accounts? What were we spending it on before 2012 (RFC's liquidation), he either lied back then or he's lying now.
If we were losing that kind of budo why did he agree to pay the TV companies to show Sevco matches?
Look at the state of our club and the Celtic Trust want to discuss JP Taylor's job as SLO at the AGM! Our club is being destroyed from the inside by Pedro and his PLC apologist, self-serving blogging lickspittles.}

31 Aug 2014 14:40:22
Don't post very often but read every day sick to death of reading all the Ronny must go carry on he's doing his best with what he got need to give him a chance Jock Stein didn't get off to the greatest of starts but he done ok! Rd is no jock stein but what he does need is time we need toget behind him and support the team he's wanting to restructure the club and that doesn't happen overnight
Campsie Bhoy

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Campsie I was all for supporting Delia, but after playing Ambrose again i'm not so sure

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With lustig injured and vvds head up his arse I don't think he had any other choice but on their return and if young oconnell can hold this type of form and progress then i'm sure ambroses days as a first pick or even a celtic player are numbered

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@deep river bhoy - is mulgrew injured? I would of had more confidence with mulgrew and denayer at cb.

Hopefully oconnell progresses. We desperately need quality in defence

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Dn30,, re mulgrew, don't know . I would like to see a" seasoned old head " quality type of cb signed as even if vvd stays he is still relatively inexperienced player and at this time we need all the experience we can get.

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Deep river bhoy- we defo need a cb, lb, cm, cf asap.

With regards mulgrew, just thought he would of been a better choice than ambrose untill we got a suitable replacement.

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I would like us to sign that Diskerud or Mahlangu for CM surely there's some seasoned CBs on a free from the prem we can sign will suit Lawells 'strategy'

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31 Aug 2014 14:33:44
poor AGAIN from celtic!whats deilas excuse going to be now!?the players have a beaten up attitude at the moment, to me I think its clear to see the players are not playing for rd and jc!its absolutely dire to watch we might need players but I wouldn't give deila any money to bring in more berets who should be sent back to cardiff tonight!i hope that tomorrow night we are talking about celtic needing a manger after being shown the door!

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Same problems that nl never got right and left us with no, cm playmaker, no decent striker and no lb to challenge izzy

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31 Aug 2014 14:27:35
What a shambles something must be done quickly! By the way berget is on loan so we can offload that in jan good move by the board that time. Stokes is an imposter . no creation at all this 4231 formation is terrible we don't have the players to do it we don't have a lone striker at the club surely he must see that now. I'm starting to lose faith in the management team . would take anybody to replace him right now Clark, Coyle, McNamara someone with a bit of experience ffs

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31 Aug 2014 14:23:46
Another feckin disgrace

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31 Aug 2014 14:22:46
This gets worse as it progresss
There is something not right with the player attitude
No fight
Maybe RD has list them?

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On the evidence of recent games I think it's fair to say we won't be winning anything this season sad to say.killy

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31 Aug 2014 13:50:50
Young boy o'connel looks very good on the ball I hope pl isn't watching this as he will probs punt vvd and use that boy as his replacement

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Thought he looked very poor Tam. I'm struggling to think of anyone who had a good game. The def was all over the place and Dundee could have won by 2 or 3. can't see it getting better anytime soon!

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31 Aug 2014 13:23:37
For anybody "lucky" enough NOT to be watching this DRIVEL!

For the purposes of doubt outwith the goal the TWO other best chances of the half have fallen to Dundee with Gordon pushing a fab effort on to the post

Big Efe has just had an effort that has stunningly saved by the Dundee right on the whistle of HT from a Stokes free kick! it is the only real effort Cetlic have had in the FH he has taken Berget off for Griffiths on the 40th minute!

ATVB

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31 Aug 2014 13:37:28
If you look at all of my posts I have said RD won't make it. Berget a very poor player. We have 64% possession and only 1 dangerous shot at the end of the first half. If Delia stays we won't win this league. forget the poor squad, they are good enough to walk this league which they did by 29 points last season. The difference is Delia. We are not an experiment Mr Lewall. You appointed this guy for whatever reason which no one could understand. At the end of this game we will be 6 points behind the leaders. 5 points behing Hamilton Accies. What is going on?

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Ive wondered for a while johnny how many managers knocked us back b4 they offered it to RD, got to be more than just keane

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31 Aug 2014 13:52:47
Hi Johnnymac , If you look @ my posts I say this is a squad that last season went CIRCA FOUR MONTHS without conceding a game or a GOAL! minus Sammy and latterly FF and in my eyes Gordon has not put a foot wrong yet , atvb

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The negativity on here is astounding. Pats on the back for claiming RD wouldn't succeed? Really?

The very same people would have been on here defending Henrik Larsson, if he'd had the same start as RD, because, well. because.

We should have learned (from the Lennon years) that the club needs reshaped from top to bottom. RD is trying to do that. Get behind him.

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31 Aug 2014 14:48:43
Poeticpstient I don't want Henrik as manager and if he set his team up as poorly as Delia does then I would say the same about him. I have no agenda against Delia. He is however in my opinion not experienced enough for this job. We don't have a great squad but they are better than this. Yes the club needs to change as we spend £32 mill a year on the football side alone but Delia needs to play a formation that gets results whilst he changes things. He should not continue to play this 4-2-3-1 or whatever variation he is playing with this personnel. Playing this system requires the full backs to be wing backs and get wide and put crosses into the box. it is not working. Commons is not in the game. Berget sits out left and delivers nothing yet continues to get a game? Just getting behind Delis is not going to make any difference to what is happening. I want him gone.

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31 Aug 2014 14:49:43
Jamiebhoy you are spot on my friend.

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Right now we are there for the taking. kiss the league goodbye if this is our squad. A few people backed RD and suggested the CL mess was Lennon's players. Well, Lennon's players never played like this. very poor attitude a quality. I saw nothing positive today

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Poet Me neither for HL a suspect NOW the first thing he did before turning it down he checked with his friends NL & Big Johan as to why they chucked it

What abysmal Record under NL okay we were poor in the cups latterly! but we made the last 16 season twice am fed up fkin typing this but do you realise how poor LW and Maribor were? Now we are drawing with the team promoted, having hit the target THREE times and scoring with a DEFLECTED fkin goal FFS! what are you watching?

As for this BERGET ( help us out here Ed please ) but when he signed was his record not something like 16 MNUTES of football in the prior SIX months?

Aw that's right the last manager to see something in BERGET was a certain OLE GUNNAR SOLJKAR! you know the Norwegian manager with the great track record! ( sound familiar )? atvb

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He's not experienced enough?

Okay, for the sake of debate - who is? Just so I know the level of "experience" you require for the job:

No experience in management whatsoever - as was the case with Neil Lennon?

OR

Years of experience, both in Scotland and in the EPL - as was the case with Tony Mowbray?

Just so there is a gauge.

It's a bad start - I get it. We all get it - but this I want him gone nonsense is just that: nonsense.

Wim Jansen and Gordon Strachan got off to very poor starts, and in GS's case, with a much better team. They didn't do too badly.

Tony Mowbray got off to one of the best starts - better than Neil Lennon - and look what happened there.

I'm not suggesting you wanted Larsson, what I'm saying is I don't believe (for a second) that you would be posting things like, I want him gone. None of you would.

And on the subject of Henrik Larsson, I seem to remember him getting off to an absolute stinker in terms of his Celtic career. Just as well for everyone that none of you were in charge back then or he would no doubt have been punted.

As well as which, talking about systems and players is hilarious, given that every Celtic manager has faced this - even MO. Why does he play - sure x can see he is a dud, yadda yadda yadda.

I'm not saying RD will work out - I'm not even suggesting he'll get time - all I'm saying is that we should get behind him, and embrace the change that he wants to implement. If the players don't want to change, then they should find another club. Who in that team is irreplaceable? No one.

The more I hear about "an experienced" manager, the more I think you lot buy into the Ally McCoist school of thought - "Ally's still learning his trade". despite being an assistant and Manager for the last 10 years. He's an experienced Manager - he's just not got a clue.

RD has been a Manager for 6 years. more than Jackie MacNamara, Paul Hartley and Steve Clarke combined.

I genuinely believe Rangers made a huge mistake binning PLG - as he was trying to do the same. They could have reinvented the football club - instead they brought back the Cardigan and the most boring football this side of Carlisle.

Finally, JamieBhoy you're right, they did do all that last season. They also got knocked out of both cups at home to Morton and Aberdeen, the latter of which being worse given how bereft of heart they showed. They were shown up in all but one of our Champion's League matches, and even then we weren't great. Not to mention an absolute drubbing in Spain - and, lest we forget, the scrape through against Karagandy.

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Additionally, Jamie Bhoy, I didn't say we had an abysmal record under Neil Lennon.

Although, I'm not surprised you have the Lennon blinkers on - given that you have convinced yourself we got to the last 16 under him twice. Hate to be the bearer of bad news on that.

And I didn't say we played well today either. Nor did I say anything about Berget. Although, on that, I seem to remember Miku, Lassad, Murphy, Bangura to name but a few - so let's not pretend that Lennon didn't make any faux pas in that department. In fact, there is an argument to be had that at least we are getting a chance to see that Berget may not (or may be who knows - see my Larsson comment above) be up to it. One of the great mysteries of the Lennon era was signing players and then giving them 2/3/4 minutes at at time.

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And JB, are you now giving credit to Larsson for NOT taking the job? ED are you hearing this! Unbelievable!

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One final thing on LW and Maribor JamieBhoy, given that you are sick of typing about how poor they were:

Last season LW, Maribor and Karagandy were all in the Europa league group stages.

Karagandy didn't win a game, and of the three, racked up the least points.

Maribor qualified, knocking out FA cup winners Wigan in the process.

Warsaw were eliminated from a group that included Lazio and Trabzonspor.

You can say that LG and Maribor were poor - but Karangandy were every bit as poor, and a bit more besides.

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Poet, Our game is LIMITED, Firstly a believe our CEILING is the last 16 if we are not going to SPLASH OUT, if we are not going to pay "laughable wages" then we have to see our game for what it is!

You seem to "cross reference TM WGS even the start that HL made in what a presume you are referring to is ONE pass to Chic Charnley so if you are "scrapping that level of the barrel" you are really inept! IMO

You say the biggest mistake Rangers made was dumping PLG really so did we do the same in Dumping John Barnes? It is well proven that that it never worked for PLG, JB, even TM there was a fantastic article written by a BBC journalist at the time RD was appointed (Mcpherson a think was his name) who stated there were many similarities in RD that lay in TM as you say TM got off to a great start! he was also allowed to bring in TEN players and a further THREE in the Jan window but never worked it out for him!

Who do a want as a manager? Well a don't want a Celtic manager that turns to the crowd today and did what he did a don't want a Celtic manager that says " a Don't like loan signings it only improves other teams players" and "flipflops" a don't want a manager who says LG is the best finisher at the club only not to play him or bring him on and desperation! A don't want a manager that says "we were waiting on EFE'S experience" only to play him out of position BADLY AT THAT!

as for your point 11 a would hope that Ed would give me this IT WAS ME that the night before lennon chucked it before anyone else that has got WIND OF IT that said LARSSON was the favourite on here! I never wanted LARSSON! as manager! atvb jb7

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And as for the Ally McCoist reference how is it possible that a "lower league" "learning his trade manager " commands a bigger wage than our experienced manager?

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By the way poet WE MANAGED TO BEAT SHAKTAR!

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I'm going to have to address these points as written as they make very little sense.

-Poet, Our game is LIMITED, Firstly a believe our CEILING is the last 16 if we are not going to SPLASH OUT, if we are not going to pay "laughable wages" then we have to see our game for what it is!

I'm not sure what this is in reference to at all. It makes no sense as a reply to anything I said. You claimed we made the last 16 twice under Lennon. We didn't.

-You seem to "cross reference TM WGS even the start that HL made in what a presume you are referring to is ONE pass to Chic Charnley so if you are "scrapping that level of the barrel" you are really inept! IMO

I'm assuming by 'cross reference', you mean 'compare'? It's a fair comparison and of the managers, it highlights the difference in the start, and end, of their Celtic careers. In other words, a Manager's reign can't be judged on a handful of games. As for the Larsson comment, it was underlining how fickle fans can be - and is totally justified. I remember the reaction after that game - yes one game, and one stray pass which you conveniently forget lost us the match - and many were calling him a dud. Just like people where saying "Wim who?" And "Moravcik is an over the hill unknown".

I'll look past the irony of calling me inept for an opinion, and then justifying it as just your opinion.

-You say the biggest mistake Rangers made was dumping PLG really so did we do the same in Dumping John Barnes? It is well proven that that it never worked for PLG, JB, even TM there was a fantastic article written by a BBC journalist at the time RD was appointed (Mcpherson a think was his name) who stated there were many similarities in RD that lay in TM as you say TM got off to a great start! he was also allowed to bring in TEN players and a further THREE in the Jan window but never worked it out for him!

First off, how is it well proven it didn't work for PLG? He got less than half a season and a revolt in the dressing room led by Barry Ferguson - hardly a bastion of all that's great in the game. Did it work? No but neither did it fail because it wasn't given the chance to. This is my point.

To compare PLG and KD/JB is a total straw man argument for two reasons:

Firstly, the circumstances involved are completely different. Celtic were going through wholesale changes as a Club at that point - and where also trying to implement a European Director of Football model, with KD which was ultimately unsuccessful. Indeed, KD was as big a problem as JB was. Again, should we have stuck with it? No BUT we should have given JB the season to see it out. Sacking him and using KD as manager for the rest of the season wasn't a change, it was using JB as a sacrificial lamb. It's no surprise that KD wasn't blamed at the time - and we all know why that was.

TM is a much better comparison, however it's also unjust because it's a comparison based on philosophies. You could easily compare RD to Klopp or Rodgers in that regard. In fact, Rodgers is a great comparison, why? Because he suffered a poor start to his Reading career and was sacked 6 months into it. We all know what happened from there on out.

Another problem with your TM comparison is that you totally contradict yourself by saying how well backed TM was. Clearly RD has not been. TM wasn't good enough - I accept that, but even he got 3/4 of the season and was backed heavily. Infact, the fans stood by him for the most part - and it was only when they didn't, he was gone.

-Who do a want as a manager? Well a don't want a Celtic manager that turns to the crowd today and did what he did a don't want a Celtic manager that says " a Don't like loan signings it only improves other teams players" and "flipflops" a don't want a manager who says LG is the best finisher at the club only not to play him or bring him on and desperation! A don't want a manager that says "we were waiting on EFE'S experience" only to play him out of position BADLY AT THAT!

I didn't ask who you wanted as a Celtic manager but it doesn't matter seeing as you set up the question and then failed to answer it anyway. Lots of what you don't want, not so much of what you do. I didn't see the gesture today, so it would be remiss of me to comment on it. RD said he doesn't like loan signings - did he say he wouldn't use them? Big difference. In an ideal world he would turn to our youngsters but if they aren't good enough, what is he to do?

Saying LG is the best finisher is true. That doesn't mean to say he has to start. Kris Boyd was the best finisher at Rangers for years and he didn't get a game. Lambert is a better finisher than Wellbeck but doesn't get ahead of him for England. Jordan Rhodes is the best finisher Scotland have, yet he can't get in the team. It's not all about finishing ability. Didn't Gordon Strachan say that Derek Riordan was the best finisher at Celtic yet never played him? And why would he, he had Scott McDonald, JVH and Zurawski to choose from.

Finally, I don't agree with some of RD's decisions - and I certainly wouldn't play Ambrose again let alone start him as I think he's bereft of confidence and is now a target, so it's time for him to move on - but I can disagree with decisions without calling for people's heads.

-as for your point 11 a would hope that Ed would give me this IT WAS ME that the night before lennon chucked it before anyone else that has got WIND OF IT that said LARSSON was the favourite on here! I never wanted LARSSON! as manager!

I didn't say you wanted Larsson as manager but well done on your grasp of celebratory hindsight.

Your McCoist comment makes no sense. I'm not sure you understood what I meant.

Yes we beat Shaktar - but with a huge slice of luck, a better team than we have now and a manager who had been in the job for three years prior. I've said it before, I'm not convinced Lennon would have beaten either LW or Maribor. The reason I mentioned those teams was simple, you highlighted how poor LW and Maribor were. I'm saying they are better than Karagandy and look how we struggled. A year on with a weaker team and a Manager finding his feet, is it such a surprise we were beaten. Not for me.

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31 Aug 2014 16:54:10
Poetbhoy you keep on backing Ronnie if you think that is the right thing to do. The john Barnes episode or Mowberry episode are in the past. So what? All that matters is how we play and getting results. Post a message after we start to play in Europa League or after our game with Hearts. Look, we all want Celtic to do well and that means Ronnie being a success. But at what point do you decide he can't do it? Is it if we don't win the league or we come bottom of our Europa League group. You need to decide at what point we draw the line. If your view is our Europa Legue or SPL title does not matter then I think there are 60,000 Celtic fans who think you are wrong. He will be gone by Christmas and we are in for more performances just like today.

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Another thing on your McCoist comment: at one point before his "cut", he was earning more money than Jurgen Klopp (and FYI Neil Lennon). He was in the forth tier of Scottish Football, Klopp was in the Champions League final.

Let's just agree that's ridiculous.

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Johnny, I know they are in the past. I'm not saying they should be used to justify or vilify RD.

All that matters is how we play and getting results?

Well which is it?

I won't post a message after those games, because my opinion won't change. If we are beaten, we are beaten. It changes nothing. I'm saying he should get time - which is AT LEAST two windows, and a full season. That's what I'm suggesting - after which, we can evaluate. Has there been improvement, should we move forward? We're still in AUGUST and people are saying he should go - which is ridiculous.

To be clear, I'm not saying he will be a success, nor am I blindly following him - I can see the mistakes. I'm saying he must be given time to succeed, or fail.

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Poet, I take your point on Wim a made the same point!

JB TM even PLG got the time they got they all failed BIG TIME but let me get my head round this as a Celtic fan you were willing for PLG to succeed?

Everyone was willing to give RD a chance but to date that is right now it is not 1 or 2 or 3 it is MORE than that and as a said he looks out of place, and his actions today were embarrassing as a CELTIC manager!

My reference to McCoist was clear as you typed " a learning in the job manager" a agree with you he is a clown!

But how is it possible that such a manager is on a better wage that our vastly experienced cup / league winning manager? on a lower league

Check the polls over the last few days on here, they would not have been produced/aired if they were not relevant atvb jb7

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You are spot on mate and I typed it here he was on more money than NL a don't know about JK but that's the thing it is not good enough!

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31 Aug 2014 17:57:22
Poet you and I are passionate supporters and I value your opinion and I can see where you are coming from. From your post it is clear you know your stuff so fair play for sticking to your guns. We do however need to win the SPL. Anything less is unthinkable. You have to give me that point? Europa League. Well getting stuffed every game would not sit well. So it is about the results first and foremost. Issue I have us the squad can't play this style of football and it may take 4 transfer windows to get the players in he needs so do we wait 2 years to see if this guy is the real deal? I leave that thought with you.

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JamieBhoy, I didn't say I wanted PLG to succeed, I said I thought they made a mistake in getting rid of him so early into his tenure.

Everyone WASN'T willing to RD a chance from the get go - that's the point. We aren't even into September yet, so to claim he's been given a chance is erroneous.

As I said above, I didn't see the gesture, so I'll take your word for it - if it's as you say, I can't condone it, nor would I try to.

My point about McCoist was more to do with experience rather than money but I agree with you - what he is paid is way over and above what he should be. (which if based on Management skills would be very little)

The polls aren't proof of anything - except the general fickleness of fans.

Johnny, you too. I appreciate everyone's opinion, and their right to share it.

I COMPLETELY agree that a failure to win the SPL would be a major black mark (ie a disaster) that would be hard to survive, however, if we lose the league and it's clear that his ideas are working, and starting to bear fruit, it wouldn't be an instant dismissal.

We should remember that when we were reinstated into the Europa League after the Sion debacle (both on and off the pitch) we did okay - and it's generally accepted that the time spent in there went along way (for both players and management) to help our improvements in the CL the following year. Do I want to lose every game? No. I want to win every match but I am realistic and if there are lessons to be learnt from these European games - they are worth that in itself.

I get your issue, I really do but to answer your question, I'd flip it and ask you this:

If it took RD four transfer windows to get the players in he needs, and two years to implement a high pressing, attack minded game that is not only suited to Europe, but miles ahead of what we have in this country (ourselves included) would you be willing to give him it?

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Poet, in the nicest possible context if you could bear to watch that DRIVEL for a FULL season or even FOUR windows, I suggest you change your signage to thepatientcelt mate me? No!, am sorry for the record as a previously said JB got to Feb, TM to March but a am wondering if RD will be the shortest ever "lifespan" manager

IMO he won't survive a "cup shock " now mate

There no fight, no verve, no structure, no real shape, no (even now so early) no consistency, no leadership and we are struggling to even get the ball forward! FFS

And today we were very lucky to get away with a point

ATVB JB7

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JamieBhoy, in the nicest possible way - that question clearly wasn't for you and was in response to Johnny's reverse of the same question.

I have no problem with the name change. Patience is a virtue a lot of football fans could learn to embrace.

As for a cup shock - Celtic being beaten by anyone post the demise of Rangers is and should be considered as such. The problem is, it happens a lot and if we fired managers because of it, Lennon wouldn't have lasted past the interim stage.

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Poet, I previously said on here mate it is like "cats lives" a agree NL used his 1st against Ross County WGS against Brataslavia but they did turn it around

But this is DRIVEL mate and when he done that call it "signage" today a was mortified by the actions of that too!

ATVB

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31 Aug 2014 13:21:20
wots RD doin?, the angry looking fistpump to motivate the fans, try motivating your players, not one looks like they give a toss today.

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31 Aug 2014 13:11:32
Bereft of quality all over the pitch and the bench. Not one player both good enough and interested enough to provide that moment of inspiration required to win any game. That Berget gets a starting berth shows how poor we are. No striker worthy of the name. A manager out of his depth and a board not interested in bringing in any quality or worse still the views of the fans.

I am becoming rapidly disillusioned with it all and increasingly unwilling to part wth my hard earned cash and time to watch the poorest product I have seen in over 20 years from the team I love. 5 hours without a goal as we speak.

A shadow of the team we all adore.

Time for change right through the club.

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Over 5 hours without a goal. New systems, players, transitional period - say whatever you can. That's a pretty poor effort for "attacking minded, attractive football"

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31 Aug 2014 13:27:15
Usual suspects in Izzy, Ambrose and Stokes, absolute mince! As for Berget, absolute imposter, who ever thought this numpty could play football?

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31 Aug 2014 13:01:22
Our squad is so weak at the moment I hope that PL is earning his wage as we are seriously weak in so many areas. It's going to be an interesting season ahead!

HH

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31 Aug 2014 12:58:45
We are becoming a joke, under lennon we scored countless first minute goals in the spl now this rubbish against dundee the board are about to learn the hard way that trying to cheap it will backfire

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31 Aug 2014 12:58:00
Ronny has to go, disaster from start to finish, I know the reality will probably be JC taking over until the end of the season (PL dream has come true) RD has to go anyone who thinks anything else is delusional.

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Hi Ian, agreed if PL says "Chapter 1 ha now gone for RD" how many more is he going to get and he can take JC with him as far as I am concerned

I answered you from earlier point btw!

ATVB JB7

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31 Aug 2014 12:56:38
Watching this game it's very clear izzy has to go he is a nightmare can't beat a man any more can't keep possession and most importantly he can't defend

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31 Aug 2014 12:37:17
Nice start!
FFS

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31 Aug 2014 12:25:37
I expect to win the day

But what the F**K is RD playing at with that gesture? he is the MANAGER that is embarrassing!

Still think big Sutton is a class act, should give him a pair of boots and sent him out for us let's face it folks couldn't do any worse!

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What gesture?

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What did he do Jamie?

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Like the "Eyal Bergovic" gesture to the crowd a few years ago

The arm across the angled arm is the only other way I can describe it

The "Glasgow get it up you" trying to fire up the crowd!

Hope that paints a picture best I can come up with

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Guys not got a clue.

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31 Aug 2014 11:55:20
Van djik not in squad today? Aye peter we don't have to sell him but we will anyway and leave ourselves with 2 days to bring in a couple of replacements for peanuts or better still bring in f. All! And leave us short shocking what an absolute disaster of a club right now throw in the fact that we have a new manager trying to build a team what chance has he got when they keep pulling the rug from under him. "

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31 Aug 2014 13:43:53
Chalkybhoy new managed trying to build a team. Ronnie Delia couldn't build a sand castle. Let's get real hear. These players are not as bad as they are being made to look by Delia. The whole dressing room is going nuts. The senior players have no faith what do ever in him. Wait and see what will come out over the next few weeks. He has to go.

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31 Aug 2014 11:53:32
I see VVD is not in the team today and it looks like he's the latest departure and with very little time to replace him.

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Not that there will be a chance to replace him PL won't even look and just say no one wants to be here so live with it and give us your money

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31 Aug 2014 01:47:06
Ed I just read all of wee paht previous posts that guy should have his own thread on this site honest to god my fu£&in side is sore with laughing much respect wee paht lol pmsl!!!

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31 Aug 2014 01:20:48
Here's a question, who has been our best signing last 4 years .

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{Ed007's Note - Haakon Lunov or JP Taylor.}

31 Aug 2014 01:43:15
For me big wanyama for the price we paid to the profit we made even though we don't fkn see it and the performances he put in especially in the cl. Boy was a class act

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{Ed007's Note - it can't be Wanyama, the best players are always strikers. If Wanyama was any good he'd have been playing up front!}

Nice ed, glad you joinin the bandwagon lol.

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31 Aug 2014 03:07:13
I read that post and couldn't believe what I was having to endure. The guy who wrote about best players being strikers! That only applies to amateur football as I found out. Joined a team last year and got earmarked for right back. What does that logic say about me? It's the furthest away from striker except gk and I might have been earmarked for that if I wasn't 5'7"

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It says you're not good enough to play anywhere else on the park Pedro.

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31 Aug 2014 09:01:02
Got to be commons, 300k and a great amount of goals, carried the team last season and all the other stuff him and his wife do to help players settle in. Can't put a price on all those little helpful things guys like him do that are never even thought about let alone spoke about. I'll be gutted if he leaves. But according to some people on this site "this is our last chance to get a fee for a 30 year old' pffft, some of you are as bad as the board.

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For me the best was Ledley. Had offers from EPL clubs but chose to come to us and cost nothing. Great servant, consistent, caused no trouble and if some reports are to be believed we got close to 2 million for him with 6 months to go on his deal.

A close second Commons, only reason he is second was his second season where he hardly played and only scored 1 goal all season.

I couldn't pick a worst from the 15 or so candidates.

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Pedro, your lucky you are not right back in the dressing room. Lol.

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