Celtic Banter Archive August 30 2015

30 Aug 2015 22:03:24
Fellow fans of CFC

It seems to me that there is a growing chasm between the club's supporters. On one side we have the fans who will support anything, noting that by definition at least, that is the job (no more and no less) and then there are others who see their support as a contract of sorts that involves getting something back in return. Whatever side of the fence you are on, I would remind ALL of the following:

FANS will always be the lifeblood of the club because we are the income/revenue generators. As customers, we have the right to buy in and purchase at any level we choose, or equally, to opt out if the product isn't worth making time and money sacrifices over. Staying away and driving change can be as relevant as staying with the team and the board / management.

I for one believe that you can love celtic and point blank refuse to finance bad practice or lack of ambition, or general malaise. It is a 2-way street for me. That does not make one a glory hunter. Far from it. I loved watching Celtic steadily improve (when they weren't winning) and see that improvement manifest in a cup success and then a league success back in the day. It was all the sweeter because it was earned.

At the moment, our stadium is half empty.HALF EMPTY and yet the revenue collapse hasn't been worthy of back page news.

As our revenues slide, across the City, their revenues are building. Their home gates are around 50% higher than our own (in real terms, IE people count) and yet we are gearing up for another title tilt and a sincere go at the domestic treble.

The match-day experience at Celtic Park has become a damp squib and it must be a worrying time for those in the main stand with calculators. They see green seats and the the stay away hoards talk of malaise and lack of ambition, with the Green Brigade caught in the crossfire.

Granted, across the City they have been swept up in a wave of euphoria and promise, but it is a story in its own right. Rangers perhaps looking at sincere re-generation and rejuvenation with Celtic regressing, caused in part by in-fighting and indifference towards domestic success.

The imbalance reversal may create 2 glasgow giants with matched revenue and resource and thus, may be the catalyst Celtic need to get backsides back on seats and the tills clicking again. COMPETITION sells. it motivates. It inspires. It captures the imagination. it means going crazy in the 86th minute when Celtic win over Hamilton to snatch a comeback 2-1 win. If that happened this season, IE a goal in the 86th minute there would be about 10,000 left in the stadium, no one close for a hug or a head scratch, with the rest in Silverburn M&S weighing in to the Dine in for Two deals!

We have all been aware of Celtic's public enemy number 1 (complacency). It isn't Rangers or any other team for that matter. It is ourselves.; inside the club and beyond.

I remember the dark days pre Scottish Cup win over Airdrie when a league championship seemed like the impossible task. Now we have become miserable with our successive titles and countless cups and want to compete on another stratosphere. There is nothing wrong with wanting to dine at the top table, but rich food and wine can be the cause of gout. One should be reminded that the staple diet (domestic dominance) is no bad thing to create the right balance for a healthy existence!

Celtic are at some sort of crossroads now. There is a new craze sweeping the south west of the City and what should have been cannon fodder for a powerful, well funded, well oiled, high quality, easy on the eye Celtic is looking scarier by the week.

But what of us? The fans. When we feel like turning up, we turn up JUST on time and a good 30% start to leave after 75 minutes.

Again, no laws broken but it is quite telling is it not? Thousands missed the Malmo 2nd goal at Celtic Park. Those supporters probably cursed us down London Road and Gallowgate as they jumped in their Range Rovers and BMWs whilst the rest of us didn't know whether to applaud or boo. A huddle in the 75th minute and RD's name being chanted around our magnificent arena, and then question marks over our manager's future 90 minutes later! Welcome to the crazy world of Celtic FC.

ED, if we are A CLUB LIKE NO OTHER we all need to take a rain check and ask ourselves what that actually means. The team's indifferent displays are echoed by the fans' indifferent attitude to domestic duties. Only we can make our season an irrelevance before the end of August.

We should tread carefully. It is a different world, granted. The Kellys and Whites are gone and Sir DM will never be matched for financial stupidity, but we need to ask ourselves the more searching questions.

The relationship between team, fans, management and board is incredibly important. We can be the best and remain the best, but it will take effort on all sides and the contract being re-written

Hail Hail

30 Aug 2015 22:57:45
Paradise won probably my fault but I don't understand what your post is about .
I always thought the Celtic fans rejoiced in our victories and trophies won .
Defeats and titles lost always put us on a downer . We have always had a core support of thirty to thirty five thousand which could increase to near enough sixty thousand when attractive European nights come around . Not much wrong with our support levels and it compares well with all but the very best EPL teams . In fact I would imagine if playing EPL teams we would have fifty plus thousand every week .
I cannot compare with the current circus down Govan way as I don't think there has been much truth or honesty from that temporary club .

31 Aug 2015 07:52:15
The post is about complacency and indifference besieging the club and that being our public enemy number 1. Keep up

30 Aug 2015 17:40:14
Ronny Deila says last years cl exit was harder to take than this years exit? What does this mean for next years cl exit?. He also says regarding new signing "he plays left back and centre back, so we'll see,. Does this mean he doesn't know what's his position. This guy looks/sounds more clueless everyday. Btw can anyone tell me did he do the air punch after the game yesterday?

30 Aug 2015 18:17:05
Utter bollocks! Did you ever consider the fact he meant that he will play in either position as required?

30 Aug 2015 18:35:04
He was referring to Van Dijks situation if he stays Blackett will be more used at LB and if Van Dijk goes then Blackett will be more used at LCB

30 Aug 2015 18:36:26
Got to agree mate! getting more confused with ronnies comments everyday! He's now saying we need more experience in the team,yet he brings in a 21 year old Man U reserve and is looking to bring in young Christie from Inverness! I really don't think he knows what he wants! Really think he's been left out to dry by that smug prick Lawell but! Not a word from him recently! But if we had scraped through against Malmo we wouldn't have heard the end of it from him! He's probably to busy getting more millions than we won't spend for VVD! Totally scunnered,really am!! And yeh he did do the air punch mate,to the fans that bothered hangin about!

30 Aug 2015 18:41:20
Sounds to me like he wasn't a RD signing.

30 Aug 2015 20:17:57
Is that not just him saying we'll see where he ends up playing? Or perhaps, it's not RD that has asked for Blackett, so might not even have seen him! I don't think he's clueless. He has his hands tied. What was it about the set up that prospective managers turned down?

30 Aug 2015 20:18:42
Is that not the whole point of having scouts to find players for the manager?

30 Aug 2015 20:04:52
Dn30 how utter bollocks? that's the thing he'll play in position required exactly like charlie mulgrew, why don't we just sign an attacking midfielder or winger who can also play striker(stokes) and say he's our new main striker. i'd prefer to go for a player in a position we need

30 Aug 2015 21:01:43
RyderBrown I think you are spot on mate. If you are the manager and you need a centre half then tell your chief exec/scouts to find a centre half not a left back that can play centre half. If he doesn't know what his best position is chances are he had no input on the signing.

30 Aug 2015 23:01:55
Ryder Brown I think you are trying to create a problem where none exists . Many quality managers buy young players ( especially ) that have a degree of versatility .
That is regarded by most as a positive thing .

31 Aug 2015 09:56:33
Old bhoy, versatility etc I do understand with the mdern game and all but I believe we've bought too many youngsters that we don't know their main position. Where exactly does janko play? Big sutton was a forward(target man) but could if needed FILL in at cb. i'm not creating any problems mate that's the board and manager doing that pal

30 Aug 2015 16:28:56
I would like to dedicate this post to HenriksTongue:

John Park must go

30 Aug 2015 17:27:19
Boys the issue is that Pedro has put a business structure in place which is not to buy a player over 25 because he has little sell on value. RD had come out today and said he wants some experience in the side? So We have a manager and assistant manager with no European experiance and a squad that RD thinks lacks European experiance (Brown,Izzie, Ambrose,Mulgrew,Forrest, Commons,). The issue is the manager who thinks wining the SPL is an achievement. Who were the last Scottish side apart from Celtic and Rangers to qualify for the group stages of ant European competition? It must be 10 years ago so beTing these teams is no big deal. Fans can back RD for as long as he is there. Just wait till we get humped in the Europa league and then see the reaction. Maybe then fans will understand that Ronnie talks a fantastic game but it's all in his head. Watch Brown, Mulgrew, Forrest, Ambrose turn out for Scotland and send the performance then compare that to his they perform for Celtic? Get rid of RD now!

30 Aug 2015 17:41:33
The board must go,clearout/cleansing needed badly

30 Aug 2015 17:50:31
DN30. Many posters would agree with you, but there is no point in getting rid of John Park unless you can tell us what attributes his replacement will have?

30 Aug 2015 18:11:48
DN mate you just won't let this go lol. though both PL and JP can do better you are looking at the wrong men. This is all down to our manager.
There is no doubt whatsoever if we made the CL last year and this we would all be happy.
He has failed 3 times ffs. Legia were decent and maybe a bit early for us but there is no way we didn't have the team/squad to beat Maribor and Malmo.(Without signings)
They were better organised than we were and RDs inexperience showed in both games.
Maribor game he doesn't start Commons when he should have then when the game is petering out no real threat against us he puts on 2 forward thinking players at half time when if don't lose a goal we are thro.
Malmo game they didn't allow VVD on the ball, if you noticed Boyata was allowed all the time in the world to bring the ball out, a tactic they had worked out which meant our moves broke down more often than not. A very simple tactic at that.
Can u name 1 tactic that RD did?
Has he got our defense organised? NO
Has he got defensive set pieces organised? No
What tactics did he use in both games? None.
Are we still doing this pressing game? Supposedly but doesn't look like it.
He previously put Cifti in ahead of his best striker? Why?
2-0 nil up in 1st leg what did he do to change it at half time to see the game out as 2-0 is a great result? Nothing.
Why does he need to constantly attack when we are winning as a good coach will want to see the game out?
He said the players were scared then retracted it saying we should not be defending but attacking. Is this a necessity when a clean sheet sees us thro.
Can our manager set up a team to defend and hit on the break? (which is a necessity in Europe)Not yet.
All of the actions above are not taken by a good manager.
He is clearly out of his depth when it comes to Europe, when you consider you or I could manage us to the title.
You have also stated no ROOKIE should manage Celtic maybe so but all these actions are the actions of a rookie.

30 Aug 2015 19:08:27
Well said Rahman!

30 Aug 2015 19:28:02
Old Bhoy its simple. A scout that can identify adequate players.

Rayman just a bit of banter lol. Mate I genuinely believe if Deila had his own backroom team and had a say in transfers, then he would be an exceptional manager for us. With squad we have at moment, I have serious concerns especially our defence. We would be stronger playing 4-4-2.

30 Aug 2015 20:13:08
Nothing wrong with banter mate lol we have had our share. I just think you are looking in the wrong areas when its right in front of u mate.
Not so long ago you were pilloring Lennon for beng bottom of CL group. Oh how we wish for those heady days now eh lol.
I always said be careful what u wish for.

30 Aug 2015 20:27:35
So you agree dn30 Ronny is tactically naive when he persists with a lone striker when the personnel in your opinion is best suited to 442 😂
IN RONNY YOU USED TO TRUST lol

31 Aug 2015 17:40:51
DN you refuse to blame RD lol now its if only he had his own staff.
Gordon Strachan said great managers don't have to be great coaches, it the big decisions they have to get right.
Has RD got any big decisions right yet?

30 Aug 2015 16:05:34
Picture of VVD at the airport, guessing that's him away

30 Aug 2015 16:32:33
Pk85 our defence woes get worse. Wish VVD all the best in his career and thank him for his service

30 Aug 2015 17:52:16
Pk85 , he is not going to link up with the Dutch squad . Maybe he is going on a short holiday or maybe he is meeting someone .

30 Aug 2015 18:02:50
Does that mean we've got our £11.5m? Just read we asked for 13 but said 11.5 was a "take it or leave it". I was wanting 15 myself so hopefully there's some add-ons thrown in for good measure.

30 Aug 2015 18:47:37
Jim Tim are u serious! 15 million!! Did u watch the Malmo game on Tuesday?? or any game he's played in Europe when the opposition actually have a go! Found wanting every time! If theyr offering 11.5 then we should bite there hands off!

30 Aug 2015 21:38:03
Dh88 the transfer market has gone crazy in this present day.Today Fulham knocked back £10 million for ross McCormack,Man City paid almost £50million for sterling a guy who scored 18 goals in 97 games ,just two examples of how the market is,so why shouldn't celtic ask for £13million for vvd.Scottish clubs have been fleeced for years in the transfer market by english teams.killy.

31 Aug 2015 09:08:14
Killy the English market is partly fuelled by the need to have your quota of English born players in your team. Unless you comply you can't compete in the EPL. So all English players have a big premium. Having said that some non English players are getting silly fees but in the main it's the international players going to the big clubs. It's easy to think that everyone in EPL is transferring for 30 mill plus. If one of the top 6 ( last season) come in for you then the fee can be high but Southampton don't pay £20 mill for anyone. I think their transfer record is £14 mill. Stoke spent a club record of £12 mill this transfer window. The majority of transfers are under £14 mill but they get very little coverage. If we get £11.5 for VVD that's fine. We can win SPL without him. We are not going to do anything in Europe with him in or out of the team and if his replacement is any good we will get 2 years out of him before we sell h on as well

30 Aug 2015 15:30:22
I know I've said it before but if you can tune into the Dublin v Mayo GAA, see passion from amateur sportsmen. put the primos to shame.

30 Aug 2015 17:08:55
TTTS money has ruined the game

30 Aug 2015 17:25:15
TTTS a wonderful game finished in a draw replay on Saturday . Two very fit teams one player regularly recorded at doing over 14 k per game (70 ) mins .
A full house over 82,000 despite coverage on Sky plus R T E .

30 Aug 2015 21:44:42
DN30 I don't know how old you are.I remember in the early 1960s Sir Bob Kelly refusing permission for a Celtic game to be shown live on tv,saying if we go down this road it will ruin the game of football,my god how right he was.killy.

30 Aug 2015 23:12:30
Killy everyone is right some of the time . Fair play to Sir Robert Kelly

30 Aug 2015 14:33:59
Ed what's your thoughts on comings and goings before Tuesday, we all expect VvD will be gone and I'm expecting the likes of stokes, scepovic, boerigter and possibly a few more! Also praying that we get another striker even if it is a loan deal! Wondered if Kramaric from Leicester would be a shout! Appreciate his wages would be an issue but he's not getting a look in down there and there was an interest last season! Have you heard of any deal in the pipeline ed either in or out?

{Ed007's Note - I think you're spot on about who could be on the way out if there's teams interested, I'm hoping for more exits but those would be a start.
There's no chance of signing Kramaric I'm afraid mate, I'm expecting some loan signings and nothing really to get the fans excited - we've still to get what seems to be our obligatory loan from Man City to come in as well.}

30 Aug 2015 15:19:48
There's no chance of kramaric as his agent said last season he would never deal with celtic again as we left them standing outside in the rain while we begged scepovic to sign . Not a glowing endorsement!

30 Aug 2015 16:43:10
Wouldn't mind Pozo or Iheanacho from City

30 Aug 2015 17:40:18
We definitely want to get rid of Stokes Sceptovic and Boereigter at least . However will we be able to get anyone to sign them and pay the wages . Lawwell will be looking for a transfer fee as well. The problem Celtic have is we often agree too much wages to get players in , and if they turn out not good enough we are stuck with them

30 Aug 2015 18:52:05
2 of the three mentioned are just a waste of space on the bench where we could have someone who could actually come on as a sub or even have a few youngsters on the bench

30 Aug 2015 09:34:46
Note to Ed: Is there a permanent option for Blackett with a £3m price tag?

30 Aug 2015 12:28:29
Just read on ssn that Sheffield Wednesday have made a £10m bid for Ross McCormack.

I'm well aware of the TV deals in England, etc etc but man it breaks my heart that our club, with all the history and tradition - a huge name in football, and we can't get anywhere near that kind of fee.

heartbreaking - no other word for it

30 Aug 2015 13:16:24
I think the fact McCormack is going for crazy money AGAIN is more scary han Sheff Wed spending those figures.

30 Aug 2015 19:02:53
He's been pish at Fulham and hardly justified his previous big transfer fee. To be honest would fans rather we played in Scotland and crash out in the UCL qualifiers or try work our way up through the leagues in England and have that sort of money to buy an exciting team? I think the stadium would fill out in support for playing our way up through the leagues in England and we would make the Championship easily in back to back promotions. By then we will have the funds to compete for promotion to the EPL. I would rather us be there than qualify for UCL and get mauled by the big teams because we haven't got the money to compete at that level anymore

30 Aug 2015 10:54:02
I like most fans am disappointed once again not to be in the champions league but we are at a level just now where we do need to balance the books as zero serious cash to be made in Scottish football when you see the cash being splashed about in the English championship by so called minnows of world football how can we compete and expect to have the God given right to qualify every season with one hand tied behind our back. All the blame the board brigade may have a point but what is our exact profit after we deduct our running costs it isn't massive amounts. You listen to the Hugh keevins of the world salivating and rejoicing we didn't qualify just so they can have their free kick in at us but look at the cash Southampton and West ham splashed the last few years and both bumped out of Europe by nobodies? So I am just feeling a bit realistic and hopeful additions like Tyler blackstock will get us to a level for next season where we can finally get back to the top table again.

30 Aug 2015 11:29:59
Has it not crossed your mind that perhaps spending a bit more on quality over quantity might get us £30m for getting into the CL? Speculate to accumulate. Not every player we sign for £1-2m is going to develop and go for big bucks. In fact very few will.

30 Aug 2015 11:56:28
I don't think anyone is suggesting we spend money the way they do in England, that is just not possible, and I am not sure it would be right even if we were in that league.
My view is though that we could do more than we are doing. Surely to it should be possible to at least try and keep the same level year on year, and if possible try and improve, it's only what every other club tries to do.
There is no argument from me about developing young players, but at times you need to sign players who are more their finished article.
For example, we badly need a striker

30 Aug 2015 12:04:36
Yet another post excusing the board and moaning about the lack of income available. CL cash is not some fictious amount, it is available every season. We don't have a God given right to be in it every year, but we do have a duty to try. We are a business, but this is the business we are in, like all our competitors. If you ran a pub, it is likely that there will be others around you, you have to work at making your pub better than the others or your business will suffer.
The reality is that most clubs comparible to ours, who get there on a regular basis, perpetuate being there by CL money, a higher profile and being able to attract better players. The CL was started to help the rich get richer, we know the top half dozen teams will generally provide the winner every year and don't give a rats arse about anyone else. It has many, many flaws but it IS the only game in town, because the alternative is what?

30 Aug 2015 12:15:26
Sorry I sent my reply too early.
I was going to say that in my opinion we badly need a striker, I don't think we can just sign a youngster who might be good in 2 or 3 years, we need it now.
It's all about mixing the two, we now don't want to sign anyone unless they are raw youngsters who may be good in the future, we have to try and keep our levels up while we are working on the youngsters.
That's really all the fans want, we're not stupid, but we just want to see the same standard from one year to the next, and if possible see a slight improvement, when clubs like Malmo can do this, then I can't see how a club of our size can't at least do the same.

30 Aug 2015 13:19:25
You do need a balance Gerry. Players who have experience of negotiating the qualifiers or something similar. We can't be a constant work in progress and expect to get to the CL.

30 Aug 2015 13:57:15
Chasaboy,It's wrong to compare a business like a football club,to running a pub,football is a separate entity,a business like no other.
And with all respect people like us on the outside can only guess and speculate as to what goes on behind the scenes.
I know there is a need to invest,but at what cost? Give the manager a chance he has only been here for one season, and is trying to develop his strategy on the club and it needs time,time is something we do have a little of at the moment,

If sevco had not been relegated to the bottom tier of Scottish football, we probably wouldn't have had that time and its anyone's guess where that would have led us.

They will be back,probably next season,and I suspect that is what the glib and shameless one is keeping his wallet closed for,all these loan players have to go back to their clubs.
New ones will have to come in,and don't forget Aberdeen and Hearts are improving all the time,so it might not be Champions League we only have to be concerned about.So I would say give RD a bit more time and see where it takes us.HH

30 Aug 2015 15:00:20
I think some are missing my point I just see our club at a cross roads and the balancing act seems to be we have enough domestically but not enough internationally for Europe I so think the point of quality over quantity is valid Yeh why go for 5 mediocre 2 million players instead of potentially 2 5 million players but with 5 million players comes big wages and does a big club but a big club in Scotland have it in there structure to have 3. 4. 5 times 5 million players on big money and the rest of the squad on average wages. Would that keep a happy squad? This is what I mean not board bashing or board backing just trying to be realistic to where our club currently sits financially? As seen just recently Sheffield Wednesday 10 million fir the more than average ross mcormack what chance do we have and as I said West ham and Southampton spent 60 million in last couple of seasons each and papped our of the Europa league by so called Diddy teams? So is spend spend spend the way to go?

{Ed007's Note - It's nothing to do with the fees, it's down to the wages we pay, look at Joe Ledley and Adam Matthews, two quality players we got on a bosman because we were offering them top dollar. Teams in England will take £2/3 million or what they call a nominal fee just to get players off their wage bill, there's nothing stopping CFC paying 2 or 3 players a bit more money in wages if they are the right quality to deserve it.
There's a massive difference in the quality of player £15 - 20k a week gets you compared to shopping in the £25 - 30k a week market, if you pay players enough then they will sign, money's all they care about.
Do you think Samuel Eto'o signed for Anzhi Makhachkala because he had always wanted to play in the Russian League or win the Russian title - or was it the £350k a week tax free they paid him?
Now I'm not for a minute suggesting we should be paying that kind of money but by the law of averages the better wages you pay the better player you get.
During the 2012-13 season the average wage in the EPL was £31,000 a week, are you telling me CFC didn't have the financial clout to offer that to one or 2 different players that would improve the team - the deal to take Jordan Rhodes to Blackburn was structured in such a way that the only guaranteed money Huddersfield would get was £4 million, the rest of the deal was made up of bonuses for meeting certain targets like Blackburn getting promoted, Rhodes topping the scoring charts etc etc.
John Park told Pedro that Finnbogason wasn't £3.5/4 million but Pukki was worth £3.2, Balde and Bangura at about £2m each along with the £2.3m on Scepovice, how much did loan fees for Miku, Lassad, Wakaso and Guidetti cost us?
Remember when it comes to transfer fees they aren't paid up in full, the fee is paid up in instalments over the duration of the contract, a £4 million player signed on a four-year-deal would cost the club £1million a season. It's a lot more complicated than that obviously but that's the jist of it when it comes to paying fees, we didn't get a cheque for £12.5 million for Wanyama or Forster, that's not how it works.}

30 Aug 2015 15:13:56
We'll probably just start signing every player the Rangers go for Costa.

30 Aug 2015 15:51:48
Costa, every business on the planet run on basically the same principle, progress or keep up with competitors in your sphere or watch them take your business while you go down the pan.
Also having the zombie Utd back in the mix won't bring in more in more than CL cash, as for Hearts and Aberdeen, do you really believe that they are improving that much. It much more a case of our standards dropping and as daft as it sounds, it actually feels as if we are being held back deliberately. No I,m not into conspiracy theories, but something is going sadly wrong.

29 Aug 2015 23:51:00
Today was the first time in my 15 years of going to Celtic matches from ireland. I seen two Celtic fans squaring up to each other.

It seems the rubbish on here is felt thru out the stadium.

Absolute disgrace in my opinion that someone would pay and abuse Celtic for 90 mins. The man who got up and told the 'fan' to either support the team or feck aff deserves my support.

We need to get behind our team not moaning that craig gordon should habe caught the first shot of his double save in the 90th min

30 Aug 2015 01:21:58
It was prowbaSpot bly DN30 boring everyone about John Park

{Ed007's Note - It was probably Lisa Hague after someone said their latest instagram picture was pi$h, you know the important stuff.}