Celtic Banter Archive June 02 2014

 

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02 Jun 2014 23:07:19
Just had a look back at previous managers and some interesting points.
O'Neill resigned on 25th May, Strachan took over on 1st June.
Strachan also resigned on 25th May and Mowbray was approached on 2 June and arrived on 16th June.

In both of these cases the board moved quickly as both teams were falling apart and in desperate need of an overhaul.

I personally think the reluctance to appoint a manager are as follows;
1) the board think the current squad is strong enough and no overhaul is required
2) the delay in appointing can be used as an excuse for not getting in any decent signings
3) they haven't found a "yes" man yet.

Hopefully they prove me wrong but I can see an Owen Coyle or the likes getting it instead of us pushing the boat out and bringing in someone with fresh ideas.

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Niall, an excellent assessment. I agree 100%.

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02 Jun 2014 22:27:14
It is with regret, but I think Ally could do job here. His money would be the same, his budget would be lower but he would be playing in Europe. Downside though is that the glamour league is now the Championship, what with the higher attendances, but the chance of playing against Ross County, Hamilton, Kilmarnock and Thistle could just sway it.

Just heard Roy has opted to take assistant managers role at Villa - he really hates the North England - now trying to relegate another.

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I suppose it sounded funny in your head eh?

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@1 pmsl that's magic!

Taz

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Lots o space in there GJ for it to move around.

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03 Jun 2014 09:03:23
Its so hard to keep up with the modern world ed , when did they move Birmingham to northern England?

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02 Jun 2014 22:15:20
Is it just me or does anyone else think that a candidate for a job is actually someone who wants and apply s for it, or is it peter lawells idea to cover his back when all these candidates either drop out like rk, Garcia obv going back to tel aviv etc etc he can say well we tried to take our time for the right man and these guys became in available, I said before I never had anyone in mind for the job but now just get larsson in see what he can do cause one thing about him he ll do it his way, always honest and up front and if it's not working the kind of man to say I'm sorry folks time to give it to someone better, I say this because the whole things going to turn into a farce just shortly. Rk don't want it, moyes it ll be I need time out, on n on n on it ll go until lawells gets coyle can see it mile away

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02 Jun 2014 22:08:10
Malky will not be manager

sounded out 6 weeks ago and sees his future in england

garcia off to maccabi

weighorst off to aarhus

larsson staying at falkinburg (or whatever they are called)

keane a no go

that leaves clarke or coyle or an "unknown" not in the mix

clarke heavily linked with brighton

this could get ugly!

coyle would be the easiest to attract and the cheapest option but don't con use this with a POOR choice; maybe it is meant to be

owen coyle manager of celtic; doesn't sound silly does it

my vote

steve clarke but I will support owen coyle

i can all but guarantee that it will be coyle or clarke and you can quote me on that down the line

and I can absolutely guarantee that it will not be malky mckay

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02 Jun 2014 22:07:47
So no Keane.Just as well we have 5-10 outstanding candidates to choose from eh? Now I realise the powers that be at Celtic would not make this list public, and this obviously is the proper way to conduct business, but it seems that all the realistic possibles seem to be taking up positions at other clubs. Where does this leave us?
Are we at the bottom of the barrel or does the board have a surprise up their sleeve?

Given the way we are being run at the moment, financially at any rate, it does not seem like we will be getting any glamorous or exciting appointment.Sadly this points to a rather dull and uninspiring manager who will not be that expensive to bring in.Given the serious amount of fans who have stopped turning up to games, and let's not kid ourselves this is a problem, is this wise?

There is also the small matter of CL qualifiers. Even though we will be favourites in the first two we would be stupid to underestimate ANY opponent, particularly if they are into their domestic season and we will be playing away from Celtic Park, this is a worrying time for us.I even think this might be a pivotal time in our clubs history, it could be that important.

Add these together and the next manager, and his back room team, have a big job to do with time rapidly running out to prepare. I realise, and have posted this before, that Scotland does not have a lot to offer a serious 'name'.This narrows the field somewhat.What I wanted to see when this process started was some out the box thinking, a coach who had been noticed for playing free flowing attractive football.A name that would entice the missing thousands with a philosophy of playing the Celtic way, what I see now are pragmatic coaches who play not to be beaten.

We need to see the white smoke rising from Celtic Park and we need it soon.

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Celtic's recent financial success is down to qualifying for the Champions League, in particular getting to the last 16 and the sale of players.

I would never tell a guy like Dermot Desmond how to run a business so he will know what CL qualification means. I just can't see them appointing someone mediocre. Neil Lennon was a fans favourite (at least in the beginning for most), Gordon Strachan got us to the last 16 of the CL and Martin O'Neill a European final and treble - this surely has to be the trend? Mowbray was a disaster.

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It could get a lot worse , peter grant has all his coaching badges

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02 Jun 2014 17:17:57
If RK agreed to talk to celtic, informally or otherwise, then he must have been interested or why bother. Is it possible he was shown the script and didn`t fancy the lack of ambition shown by the board.

chasaboy

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02 Jun 2014 18:11:06
A few thoughts.
Did he want to stay in glasgow?
Did he get the full info on budget?
was he told to sell before he could buy?
or was his pay not up to scratch.
or did he just not fancy it.
Anyway if its Steve Clark i'm happy.

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That's kind of what I was thinking. Or does PL not fancy getting into a power struggle with RK? If we are going on what the daily rags are saying and the bookies Keane appeared to be No1 target

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Bhoys the media doesn't help matters much with the amount of BS they print.

Cprs1 mate i'm the same. Steve Clarke is exactly what we need

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Stevie Clarke knows the game better than any of the other guys mentioned. I have heard Mourinho/Dalglish/Zola to name a few say he is top drawer. The problem in life is that perception is reality, and he isn't seen as super glamorous, he is also seen as a no 2. Bottom line though - he has been doing all the hard work/dirty work for all those successful years at Chelsea. He also overachieved at WBA because I think the squad he inherited was rotten, and all he really brought in was free transfers and Sessignon/the lad from Everton, and he was out the door a few weeks later. Pepe Mel lasted about 3 months, so really it's a club that shouldn't even be taken seriously. Clarke is a humble guy who deserves a chance, I would be happy with him.

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02 Jun 2014 20:52:49
A may be wrong but did the director or owner not admit last week , he was wrong to sack Steve Clark?

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Out of all the depressing names mentioned, Stevie Clarke is the best of the rest for me.

He had a good first season at West Brom and to be honest, not sure what went wrong. He certainly has the 'experience'

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02 Jun 2014 16:35:37
looking at all the names mentioned in connection with the managers job ( all media outlets) it is strictly uk/eire born / based candidates, do you(ed 007) know or have heard this is what the board are confining their search to

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{Ed007's Note - It's not something I've given much thought to mate but I'm sure there will have been applicants from across Europe.}

02 Jun 2014 15:50:48
Ed - Think we all thought it was a done deal Roy Keane becoming our next manager, can you confirm if he rejected Celtic's offer? And if so why? Cheers

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{Ed007's Note - There was no offer to turn down as Keane was never offered the job and there's no guarantees that he would have been, remember it was only informal talks that were held and I don't believe for a minute that the only talks so far have been with Keane. Reading between the lines I'd hazard a guess that Keane asked not to be considered before it looked like the club snubbed him by appointing someone else, he perhaps felt if he was going to be offered the job it would have happened by now sop he jumped before he was pushed.}

Ed, if you could only mention ONE name who would you think is most likely to get the nod?

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{Ed007's Note - I still wouldn't rule out Owen Coyle.}

Malkay MacKay or Oscar Garcia will be my realistic choices.

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02 Jun 2014 16:44:13
You've had that feeling for a while now Ed. Do you think he'd be a good appointment if it happened?

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{Ed007's Note - I'm not convinced he is the right choice.}

He's the only one who doesn't seem to be going away or being touted for any other jobs.

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@4) Which is a bit worrying HB. There are a few vacancies at the minute and no-one is banging his door down for an interview. Well, none that we know of anyway, I could be wrong.

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Was Roy Keane the board/Desmond No1 choice do we think?

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02 Jun 2014 18:10:35
Alright chrisbhoy? Ed you seem ever so sure that its going to be coyle? Read an article over the week end , David moyes says he has 1 or 2 interesting proposals to mull over before deciding whether to take time out? A- is the Celtic job one of them ed? B- could we afford him? C- personally I think he is the rite man for the job!

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02 Jun 2014 15:40:56
I have made a point recently not to post on the new manager threads, due to the level of BS that gets banded around by the media. Case and point today was 08.45 left for work after reading back page spread on DR, Keano will live in Edinburgh, looking at properties ect. Just on my lunch and noticed the online record says, Kean declined the job and now Stevie Clark (not too bad if he does sign) is the latest target! Celtic will let us know when it's done - other than that it's wolf tickets the papers are selling! Whoever it is will be welcomed with open arms - unless it's John Barnes!

HH
ShottsBhoy

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02 Jun 2014 15:20:24
Would love to see someone high profile like Frank Rijkaard giving the job. A Massive club like Celtic needs a big manager. Coyle, Malky And Clarke etc shouldn't even be in the running. Celtic fans deserve some quality instead of just thinking about money as per!

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02 Jun 2014 15:33:09
Totally. He's a real box office manager. Would love Rijkaard, McLaren or Di Matteo. Since Ed made me aware of Yakins availability he has to make the list too. If we're going for somebody who hasn't quite managed at the same level, I'm impressed by Garcia. Still think it will be Moyes though!

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02 Jun 2014 15:03:13
According to tv the recommendation of Steve Clarke has come from. wait for it. none other than. wait for it. Kenny Dalglish!
Lord save us all.
If ever there was a man who we shouldn't listen to it is Kenny feckin Dalglish.

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I would love to see Clarke at celtic doing what he does best . coaching,

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{Ed007's Note - That's my view as well DRB, I would love to see Clarke in a coach/asst manager type role but I'm not so sure about him being the main man}.

Kenny feckin dalglish was a success first time around with Liverpool and won the league with feckin Blackburn, not to mention second time at Liverpool signing Suarez, Henderson both going to World Cup, Stevie Clarke if he gets it will do fine also workers under the great Jose

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Clarke wouldn't upset me, doesn't excite me either but. Let's just remember the last time Dalglish recommended someone for the Celtic job. He recommended John Barnes to the club and offered himself as a replacement if Barnes failed, both of them failed miserably!

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Mallybhoy
I'm referring to his managerial input into Celtic but seeing as you're mentioning his other exploits please remember that he inherited an all-conquering Liverpool side that could have been managed by John Barnes and still win what Dalglish won with them. He also had the first 'open cheque book' in English football when he was with Blackburn.

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02 Jun 2014 14:42:32
Feeling a bit disappointed that its not going to be RK. When Lennon left my first choice was Steve Clark but having had it in my head that RK would be announced today I was feeling quite excited about it. Now the thought of SC doesn't particularly excite me. But whoever it is, I hope they get him in relatively soon and more importantly, give him the transfer funds he needs. Time will tell :(

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02 Jun 2014 14:32:12
Lets be honest here. Anyone who's stated they have inside knowledge, bookies and media included, don't know nadda! That's been Henrik Larsson, Owen Coyle, Oscar Garcia, Michael Laudrup, Roy Keane and now Steve Clarke all been tipped as favourite for the job - over the space of 2 wks!

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02 Jun 2014 15:29:51
Garcia 33/1
Moyes 33/1
McClaren 80/1
Yakin 142/1

Sticking a fiver on each of these!

It is funny though Hamilton. Perhaps the board are putting a bit time, patience and thought into it. Did we not have more than one meeting with RK though? How or Why did it take so long to rule himself out? He must have been presented with some sort of offer.

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It's actually under 2 wks, just feels longer. I'd rather they took their time and got it right though, rather than dive in both feet first at the first person who's interested. Get all the candidates in for a chat, size them up, then make a decision who your top three picks are in case on the off chance someone knocks it back!

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02 Jun 2014 14:25:56
I just don't understand why we are looking at 2nd rate managers. The board must not think we deserve a quality man at the helm? Are we not big enough to entice someone who is actually in a job and doing it well elsewhere? Keane has a part time job, he doesn't exactly have a good managerial record and even he has asked not to be considered further.
Yet again the club seems to be trying to costs to a minimum for a position that is so important. The phrase "penny wise and pound foolish" springs to mind.

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02 Jun 2014 15:14:55
The club has became very small minded in terms of management and players while the expectation of the support remains as high as ever.
We all know about the economic restraints and poor quality of the SPFL but we still crave success and above all - quality on the pitch.

Many of us have grown up watching legendary players grace The Hoops and have enjoyed many trophy wins and superb European glory nights.
The calibre of manager and quality of player has steadily declined since MON - although we have managed to maintain a level of success.
The Board now have a 'working model' in employing low profile managers with a scouting system that discovers talent that will be sold on for profit where CL football is a bonus in a one-horse league.
The situation will only change when we obtain a serious title rival or the fans get bored settling for average.
The early exit from all European competition added to the defeats in domestic cups did have an effect on attendances and necessary income.
So it is important we at least make an adequate appointment so as not to go backwards even more.

JJ

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How about trying to get in an experienced head like Frank Rijkaard, Marcelo Lippi, Carlos Bianchi, Ottmar Hitzfeld, etc? What d'you think the chances would be?! Even Roberto Di Matteo, someone who's one the biggest prize in club football, clearly has a hunger and desire for the game?!

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02 Jun 2014 13:59:02
Hi ED

I didn't think it was going to be RK and it doesn't look like it with Steve Clarke the top priority (today)

I would be very happy with SC at the helm, had WBA playing some phenomenal stuff and their demise since his dismissal would seem to vindicate him (so minimal baggage too)

SC and John Park and a good assistant would seem sensible; I for one would be very very happy with this outcome

would you "champion" Clarke's appointment?

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{Ed007's Note - Clarke is an excellent coach but he's a very average manager and that's being kind. I really don't think 19 wins out of 59 matches as a manager is a good enough record. I wonder what the fans that were bleating about Keane's record will make of Clarke's?}

Well i’m not going to lie, i’m quite disappointed

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Hi Ed

I think it is all "relative", WBA were a "minnow" in a very wealthy EPL so he shouldn't be tarred with the "unsuccessful brush" due to an EPL record with an also-ran club; I enjoyed watching WBA and they did peak playing some great stuff

just my opinion

RK's was no better really was it especially the Ipswich Town debacle

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{Ed007's Note - Keane won the Championship in England with Sunderland who were in the relegation zone when he took over, a league many in football regard as the hardest league to get promotion from. Clarke is nearly 51 and his only time as manager was a disaster.}

Clarke had WBA in their highest league position in 30 years a few years back, just missing out on Europe, the following year he spent the least in the top flight so was always going to struggle. I think he would be a great fit for Celtic and Europe would hold no fears for him either.

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{Ed007's Note - Where were WBA when they put him on gardening leave?16th place with a run of nine wins out of the previous 41 Premier League games.}

02 Jun 2014 14:32:43
with Rk turning down the position the worrying thing has to be who is the no2 target. We are back in Coyle, Malky, Moyes territory I fear.

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Not that disappointed about Keane but please someone confirm that Stuart Baxter isn't being considered lol!

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Not having a go mrs e, but why

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I wasn’t too down on Neil Lennon and think he did a reasonable job but one thing I did not like at all was how he allowed complacency in the team to go without consequence.

Scott Brown – our Captain played in the games against Morton, Aberdeen and badly let the team down in the Champions League as well. I do like Scott Brown and think he’s been great in the League games but as Club Captain, he’s should have some of the blame. Look how he plays for Scotland then turns up for Celtic as if its a friendly (maybe a bit harsh)

This might just sound logical in my head but Owen Coyle (for example) has been in management for over 10 years and at various different Clubs without setting the heather on fire and his playing career was much the same. Some other names are much the same and have been in management or coaching longer.

I know great players don't necessarily make great Managers but Roy Keane has played under Sir Alex Ferguson and at the highest level for most of his career. He didn't just play, he was the Captain and the driving force at times.

There is no way on God's green earth Roy Keane would have let a defeat to Morton at home go without consequences for the players involved. I think Owen Coyle would mumble jumble the way Neil Lennon has, making lame excuses. Although, Roy Keane isn't without controversy which doesn't suit at times.

Sure Roy has been at Sunderland and Ipswich cutting his teeth but I think he may of learned and think it took a lot for a character like him to be Martin O’Neill’s number 2 which shows he can admit mistakes were made, maybe isn’t as arrogant as we think and he’s willing to learn. I also think players would want to play for him and he could attract players.

I’m not saying he isn’t a gamble or that I didn’t have a wee, tiny doubt but on the whole I would have been happy. Whoever the Manager is, I will back them anyway (within reason)

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Ed I think your wrong about Clarke. I think he could do a good job as celtic manager if given the chance.

His record at west Brom was 19 wins 14 draws and 26 losses. It is pretty decent considering how poor that west Brom team is plus he was given no help or support by them.

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{Ed007's Note - There's a massive difference between being a coach and being your own man. Clarke has shown he isn't capable of managing a poor team like WBA never mind a club of CFC's size. His record in his ONLY management job is 19 wins in 59 games, on what planet is that considered decent? Any manager with a record that dismal is going to be sacked.
Two days ago you thought Keane didn't have the experience to do the job yet you think Clarke's record means he would do a good job at CFC. I really can't see where you're coming from or what you're basing your opinion on.}

Ed IMO I think managing a team like West Brom is much harder than managing a team like Celtic.

By decent I mean managing to get 19wins and 14draws in 59 games with what I think is the poorest team in the premier league when he has basically no budget to work with, under constant pressure every week and no one showing support for him. Problems that most premier league managers don't have to deal with (except the pressure thing).

And by what I said about I think Keane didn't have enough experience is that he has about 5 years experience (where I think he has under performed) under his belt whereas Clarke has about 15 years (working next to managers like Jose Morinho, Avram Grant and Kenny Dalglish).

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{Ed007's Note - Your first sentence set the tone perfectly for the rest of your post.}

You think it's harder?

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{Ed007's Note - Of course it is, it's harder to win games than lose them, losing is the easiest part of football. At CFC you are expected to win matches and trophies, the weight of expectation and the pressure can suffocate a manager. As I've said Clarke is a brilliant coach but a very poor manager, Mowbray done a better job than him at WBA and look how that worked out for us.}

02 Jun 2014 13:36:03
Keane staying with Ireland

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BenBhoy

RK is a no and Clarke is the top priority

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02 Jun 2014 13:11:47
Guys wasn't so long ago there were posts on here in outrage about the way Lennon was bein treated in the media etc. Yet soon as he gone its he got a big ego. he tactically inept, his signings were crap, cudnt win a treble blah blah blah, now while we all got our own opinions and I was quite happy with a change don't you think we should give the guy a break after all he is 1 of us thro and thro.And went thro a hell of a lot of BS while in the job and stuck with it while many others would have chucked it long ago.Does he get no credit at all?

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02 Jun 2014 17:15:38
To be fair I was saying that about Lennon while he was manager, don't see Wenger, ancelotti,mourinho or ferguson putting there merchandise, not in a long time have I fallen asleep during Celtic games but last season I fell asleep during 5, and woke up to the early goal scored being protected

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02 Jun 2014 11:36:39
Ed or anybody else if reports are to be believed, Keane makes €500-700,000 a year with FAI. And he's stated he won't take a pay cut for anybody (not sure what to make of a remark like this, given the things someone such as Garcia has had to say). Is this a lot more than Lennon was earning? I'd imagine it would be given it's from a National Federation. But still seems more than reasonable, I mean, Rijkaard I thought would be the calibre we should go for before finding out he was on £6m a year with Saudi Arabia. Basically, my point is, there doesn't seem to be great movement, and I hope, as with players, we don't miss out on 'priority targets' for the sake of being tight.

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Aye, you're probably right mate. The thing is but, his wage packet (like MON's at present; and Trap + Tardelli, etc previously) comes from the man who's supposed to bankroll us - Celtic's majority shareholder Dermot Desmond.

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02 Jun 2014 11:41:05
One of NLS last comments as he was kicked out of, sorry chose to leave Celtic Park, was that he would help to choose celtics new manager. That was always going to be a lot of crap comment used no more that to continue to massage his calendar branding ego. But if it's true and that's what he did then I think his suggestion was no more than a employee suggestion box ticket in the suggestion box. Would he have recommended Keano. I doubt it this is all to to with the majority shareholder of celtic flexing his muscles. As I said in a previous post I WELCOME it. What I'd like to know is what Keano thinks about NL. That would be an interesting thought. But Neil if you did recommend Roy. well done . If you didn't then your opinion was not worth the statement to the papers and it's been shown how much confidence DD had in your ability to take celtic to the next level.

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Well you don't need to worry yourself Stu, cause he's staying with Ireland.

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02 Jun 2014 11:05:11
A have a theory could be a load of p1sh lol but lookin at it now a think pl and desmond knew a long while ago lennon was leaving and that's partially the reason keane was made number 2 with the ireland national team. Think dermott probably spoke to both him and mon and mon has been basically grooming roy keane for the celtic job ever since roy joined martin with ireland. As a said just a theory so could be miles off

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You missed the boat on that. A news paper reported it days ago that this was their belief

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Might not be a million miles off the mark there mate.

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02 Jun 2014 13:37:31
Stu a don't read the papers mate

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02 Jun 2014 08:19:54
Lennon had to hand his notice in because his European ambitions was bigger than that of are top brass, getting in to Europe is good enough for lawell and co that gives them ther bonus, so what ambition has Keane got obviously none in Europe if rumours are right on him getting the hot seat at paradise, and I hope I'm wrong but I think cl football will not be at cp for the next few years like Lennons way of football or not he done the job of getting us in the cl group stages and I think mr Desmond and lawell will look back on saying no to Lennon as the biggest mistake they made in ther time at paradise, good luck Lenny, are lose is an other teams gain

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Or you could spin it the other way.Maybe, if rumours are to believed, there were problems behind the scenes at Lennoxtown?

As for CL qualification, who knows but you cannot have been happy with last seasons displays? Let's be brutally honest here.When we beat Barca it was a fluke, yet Lenny was lauded as a tactical genius.Yes we had a wonderful night and it raised our profile in European football but no more.

Will we ever find out the truth behind Lennons departure? Probably not.The reason for this is because Lennon has taken a pay off to say the right things, bit of a cop out if you ask me.

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02 Jun 2014 11:39:19
I certainly think he had one hand tied behind his back. Then perhaps RK will sit down and demand he knows exactly what sort of funds are available. I mean, how much did the board actually trust NL, to have the manager of a club our size on a rolling contract. Think you big him up a wee bit too much though. I was more disappointed when WGS left.

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