Celtic Banter Archive May 29 2014

29 May 2014 22:26:03
So of it is to be RK, what can we surmise about NL's departure & CFC's ambitions.

1.Keane is no "yes man" and no shrinking violet

2.He would be becoming CFC manager with more experience than NL had when he was originally appointed

3. He would not take anything less than everyone's "best" which can be a very good (and very bad!) thing; see point 4

4. NL was always good at protecting poor individual performances and talking up key player's transfer valuations; some of the things he used to say post match left me scratching my head and I wondered if we were watching the same game at times BUT this had its "commercial" advantages, chiefly, players being moved on for very high transfer fees (aided by media buy-in when it came to talking up the merits of some of our average players who transferred for eye watering fees)

5. If Keane, based on past experiences, gets "stuck in" to under-achievers and goes "public" with his dissatisfaction it will be very interesting to see who comes out on top. There is a real team spirit and hard core at CFC (brown, commons, mulgrew etc) and I would be concerned about a breakdown between coach and players and resultant collapse in player values (about PL may have as much to do with player fees as the boss)

6. I am not too sure if Keane can be a successful conduit between players, fans and the board .he could be termed "divisive" and this may not even be his intention (more a characteristic or consequence of a character trait); has he got this under control now?

7. Would young emerging players want to come and play for Keane if Keane came calling; I would probably say "yes"

8. The appointment would tell me that CFC (at boardroom level) are not quite ready to throw in the towel and continue with the downsizing (slightly unfair to say whether they are engaged in such a strategy in any case as I sit here this evening) but RK would be (overall) seen as an ambitious appointment

9. in a "britain-wide" sense, I think the appointment would capture the attention of your Linekers, Hansens, Lawrensons and other major football pundits and personalities (we'd still get our mention on the BBC news at 10!)

10. Intriguingly, interest in Celtic would surge as Keane has a good many people who absolutely idolise him, so there could be a commercial upside at the start of his reign as his fans become more involved with CFC and our progress

11. I would say that this appointment would suggest that there was indeed trouble behind the scenes with NL

12. RK would bring back the thunder and, subject to performances, could maintain a level of high intensity at home and away

13. Overall an "intelligent" appointment; if it works out then "great" and if not the Board would have an opportunity to move away from Ireland and former players etc to find the right "international" appointment if it comes to that

14. Not too sure I like his media style so we would maybe have to get used to hearing only a very few words from our manager (in the strachan mould)

RK was a legend; possibly the very best in the past 50 years (as a player in his position) and no one can ever take that away from him and Celtic may be the ideal home for RK to build up a stellar managerial record (which, for him at the moment, is a little bruised)

marks out of 10.probably a 6.5 to 7 out of 10

my preference would have been an emerging dutch boss like marco van basten or a proven coach like Steve Clarke but that's me .

He may well not be a yes man but the celtic manager job is a higher profile than mons assistant so he may well agree to work under financial restrictions and agree with the party line to get himself in the limelight again as a stepping stone back to epl management?

29 May 2014 21:37:39
I don't want to upset anyone but just seen celtic are in advanced talks with Roy Keane I for one do not want him anywhere near celtic park he will bring nothing but trouble to that dressing room he is arrogant and a bully how dose the rest of the fellow hoops fans feel be grate to hear you views maybe some of you have herd different what about you Ed have you herd this?

{Ed007's Note - Of course I've heard it.}

29 May 2014 20:11:55
As posted on 22/05 keane being pursued byDD.
At least it proves to some doubters on here that when I post it's not bs.
Still not for me, won't play the football we want. Only positive may be that DD throws more funds at him than budget allocated to NL

Aye n look at whit he done wi cash at Sunderland: £80m on 39 players (including Pascal Chimbonda, David Healy, Greg Halford, Liam Miller, Andy Cole n not to forget - £9m on Craig Gordon) in just over 12 months wi very few success stories!

@hamiltonbhoy his signings have appalling. In my eyes he is no better than lennon in all aspects.

DD will do as he pleases. i'm starting to think any manager appointed must be "celtic minded" from now on in to put backsides on seats and sell celtic merchandise.

We need someone who has won trophies and experience of managing in Europe

Sorry, Keane only came to Celtic when his career was almost over. He loved us that much but would not drop his salary etc.etc. Not for me and I will be very disappointed if he takes over. (I hope its just a red herring to deflect the real man discussions)

Why would Keane come to Celtic at any point other than to do his swansong? Be serious man it's the Scottish league. Guys like the king of kings are truly one offs these days and to be honest we will be lucky to ever see that sort of loyalty again. It's just the way the game is, and will be until hopefully the EPL bubble bursts. I don't know anything about Keane personally, but if he supports the hoops good on him and if he's passionate great. You nee drive to achieve and I'd happily give him a shot. Not many managers are battering down PLs door, sure Celtic are a big club, we love them and it's special but we have to be realistic, Glasgow and the SPL or whatever the fec it's called now just don't float a lot of people's boats, even more so since the bears died. HH

That's what I was saying last night DN, Desmond needs to think outside his Celtic minded box + Lawwell needs to think outside his biscuit tin (or Tim) box! I just hope the club speaks to ALL candidates before coming to a decision, they might actually surprise themselves when they interview others. Desmond is effectively making a footballing decision based on marketing reasons. I can already see the CFC trademarked Tricolour's with "Keano" + his face on them!

@2) HB, I agree with most of your point except the bit about the new boss needing to be 'Celtic minded'. I think we need to get rid of that notion because a good manager who produces a team that gets results will soon get bums on seats and sell merchandise. Look at Lenny, he was Celtic minded but he preferred to sell his own merchandise!

I think you've picked me up wrong ChrisBhoy, I said Desmond needs to think OUTSIDE his Celtic minded box. Meaning I don't want us limiting our candidates to ex-Celtic players!

@7) Yes HB, I read your post wrongly. Agree 100%, we need to consider outside the usual names.

29 May 2014 20:01:32
Did anyone pick up on Big Victor's quote today, from the metro strangely enough, regarding Pochettino going to spurs?

'he made me a better player, it was not like at Celtic'. Is this an insight into the reason some board members were upset with Lenny? I think it was obvious that we did not seem to be doing enough work on the training pitch, for me fitness and tactics were questionable last season, might this be the reason?

Defending set pieces and free kicks around our opponents box were pretty poor and we never seemed to look as if we had something different in our locker.These are things that should be worked on in training surely?

Goin by the fitness issue how many of our loan players wer criticized by the teams taking them about their lack of fitness? I know watt, atajic and mcgeough defo wer

29 May 2014 19:25:31
Ed, Do you still think Owen Coyle is going to get the job at CP? Lots of rumours about Keane and a few others but that's typical of any managerial vacancy.

{Ed007's Note - I'm not so sure now but until there is anything official he is still a candidate.}

29 May 2014 19:45:55
Well it looks more likely that Roy Keane will be our new manager. I really think Celtic have missed a great opportunity to appoint a forward thinking fresh talent who could take us forward hopefully to the next level . I've no idea what to expect from Keane ( if appointed ) as I never paid much attention to his managerial career down south . I will back him but with a heavy heart as I think it is a ploy to shift dwindling season books when we should be appointing someone who would take us light years ahead in Scotland and an improving force in Europe once again . As I say again a missed opportunity . DH

29 May 2014 18:14:38
Mrs E touched on it earlier, about the Champions League finalists both being from the same association and neither were the reigning champions of their country at the start of the season. I'd love to see the days where the Champions League is purely championship winning sides! Something along the lines of:

- Champions from top flight of each 54 UEFA member nations participate in new Champions League,
- 22 highest ranked members enter Group Stage,
- Lowest 4 members enter 1st Qualifying Round,
- Other 28 members enter 2nd Qualifying Round.

- Based on next season's coefficients:

Group Stage:

Spain, England, Germany, Italy, Portugal, France, Ukraine, Russia, Netherlands, Turkey, Belgium, Greece, Switzerland, Cyprus, Denmark, Austria, Czech Rep, Romania, Israel, Belarus, Poland, Croatia

2nd Qualifying Round:

Seeded:
Sweden, Scotland, Serbia, Slovakia, Norway, Bulgaria, Hungary, Slovenia, Georgia, Azerbaijan, Finland, Bosnia + Herzegovina, Moldova, Ireland

Non-seeded:
Lithuania, Kazakhstan, Latvia, Iceland, Montenegro, Macedonia, Albania, Malta, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, N. Ireland, Wales, Estonia, Armenia

1st Qualifying Round:

Seeded:
Faroe Islands, San Marino

Non-seeded:
Andorra, Gibraltar

- So based on the season just finished, the participants/Champions would be:

Group Stage:

Atletico, Man City, FC Bayern, Juventus, Benfica, PSG, Shakhtar, CSKA Moscow, Ajax, Galatasaray (Fenerbahce suspended from UEFA competitions), Anderlecht, Olympiakos, Basel, AEL or APOEL, AaB, RB Salzburg, Sparta Prague, Steaua, Maccabi Tel Aviv, BATE Borisov, Legia, Dinamo

2nd Qualifying Round:

Seeded:
Malmo, Celtic, Red Star, Slovan Bratislava, Stromsgodset, Ludogorets Razgrad, Debrecen or Gyori, Maribor, Dinamo Tblisi, Qarabag, HJK, Zrinjski Mostar, Sheriff Tiraspol, St Pat's

Non-seeded:
Zalgiris, Aktobe, Ventspils, KR, Sutjeska or Lovcen, Rabotnicki, Skenderbeu Korce, Valletta, FC Vaduz (winners of Liechtenstein Football Cup), F91, Cliftonville, TNS, Levadia, Banants

1st Qualifying Round:

Seeded:
HB, La Fiorita

Non-seeded:
FC Santa Coloma, Lincoln Red Imps

Doesn't quite have the glamour of the current setup, although there's still a good few wholesale names, but it's a helluva lot fairer for different associations to get to finals or even win it!

You know and I know Hammy that it would be a non starter. The CL is pure and simply a moneymaker. For it to draw maximum income they need to be offering 4 places for English/German/ Spanish/ Italian etc and require teams from smaller FA's to qualify. I'm actually quite surprised they haven't manipulated it so Celtic can automatically qualify for the group stages given the huge interest our games generate. I suppose the seeding system is their way of giving us a leg up.
Unfortunately, we are part of a smaller FA.

Never finished this post before I hit send. I know that's leave 36 teams after qualifying but that's an easy fix - 4 groups of 5, 4 groups of 4. Still the same, top two go through to the Last 16 - group winners seeded, runners up not.

I posted down a bit HB before I seen your post.

I would love to see a fairer distribution of the cash and over time, you would see the less glamour teams hopefully grow. What the hell has a team finishing 4th done to warrant a place in a competition for Champions?

Would be happy to see something like your suggestion in place HB

Great thought out OP. My bottom line, regardless of anything else, is that the champions of each league members of the association should automatically go into the first round proper - not play-offs, qualify rounds etc. By all means have QR's but for the second and third placed clubs etc based on the coefficient.

29 May 2014 18:01:10
I will get pelters for this but Roy Keane has no right to go for the Celtic job or take if offered if true, I'm a person that reads between the lines and does not forgive any one that hurts Celtic, Keane was the go between for fergie in the Liam miller saga in my eyes, which I personally think was a part of the couse of the history of hate between them, Lennon in my eyes is the biggest lose to Celtic since o'neil ok not every ones cup of tea with his tactics but I dare anyone to question his love for Celtic and all Celtic fans should remember that both of them left the club they adore because they were not giving the funds for a European fight what is going to be the difference for the next manger nothing, Keane in my eyes stole off Celtic when involved in that snide miller faking injury saga so me for one hope it goes to any one but Keane

{Ed007's Note - I've tried reading that three times but sorry, you've lost me.}

If keane gets job, time for dermott desmond to pass baton

Sorry ed just rabbiting on a bit at the thought of Keane in the hot seat at paradise, but my post was to say Keane was the go between for fergie to Liam miller that lost Celtic a lot of money, Keane is not to be trusted in my eyes, hope that was easy reading for ya

I have never been a lover of Keane but he is no yes man and will insist in getting real money to buy players .
His abrupt nature can be offset by employing an assistant coach to act as go between .

29 May 2014 16:02:21
Just a footnote guys, I see Barca appointed Enrique. Did he not knock them back last year.Coyle seems to be getting it in the neck on here because of this. Not my 1st choice but if it good enough for Barca lol.

Coyle's getting it in the neck because he should be nowhere near Celtic Park in any managerial or coaching capacity. He can clean the boots or empty the bins or even serve overpriced HT pizza, but please for the love of God remove him from the frame!

He never knocked back barca they couldn't offer him the job because of some rule not allowing u to manage more than 2 teams in the 1 year if ma memory serves me right he was always a cert for it this time round all the same

29 May 2014 12:21:31
Just wondering if you know how the season ticket sales are going as when I asked a couple of weeks ago you said your source at cp ticket office thought they were on target. In the last few weeks I've met numerous people who tell me they are holding back on renewals and the ticket renewal deadline was pushed back, sadly I fear if we don't appoint and back a high profile coach then we will see major problems ahead

{Ed007's Note - I was told sales were 'meeting expectations', that's different from 'on target'. The expectations might mean lower sales.}

The fact the deadline was extended by a week, as seems the norm nowadays, tells me they're not meeting target. If we announce a manager with some ambition like Garcia, Laudrup, Yakin, etc then we can expect them to take a turn for the best. But if it's Keane, Coyle, McNamara, etc then you can expect Celtic Park to be a graveyard next season again. Only positive is the Green Brigade seem to be in talks with the club over a Safe Standing (or at worst, 111) section for the new season, so that'll have a positive effect on ticket sales if either (or both) go through!

Do you have any info on expectations and actual for coming season?i think we would have expected 30-35000 renewals but I fear it will be much less what do you think/know?

29 May 2014 10:18:42
Just seen a few comments saying that the new manager should be in place by the weekend. I would disagree with that. If the decision is already made then yes he should be but if a genuine selection process is in place I would prefer we left no stone unturned in pursuit of the right man for the job.

When players come back it will be mainly fitness work and once the right man is in place by Mid June (1 month before CL qualifiers) I would be happy. It's not ideal but remember the saying, marry in haste, repent at your leisure.

Agreed mate. Lennon left a week ago today. I said elsewhere back at the time I'd hope a new manager is in place by the World Cup starting, that's two weeks away. Tbh, as long as they're in place by the time the CL 1st and 2nd Q Round draw takes place on 23rd June!

I am a bit apprehensive as I believe the Lennon departure was engineered over a period of time and the replacement will have been well sounded out in advance; reasons are:
We are facing early CL qualifiers at an 'away ground', there is a world cup which always produces hyper activity in the transfer windows and we have a few players of our own to sort.
Like deadwood, farmed out lads and injury prone liabilities.
I don't think we will break the bank with this appointment and hope we are not looking for a replacement in December if it turns into another Mowbray (Coyle or Keane incl).

Well said junglejim! If its coyle or even keane, if they didn't qualify for group stages then we would be looking to get rid before Xmas! I don't know why but I still think moyes would be the best option! Got a very poor Manchester United through group stages when getting beat by dross in the epl! So has a bit of cl experience . Worked endlessly at Everton who with tv money weren't exactly big spenders! Can work on a tight budget. Handled big time players, Rooney, baines and the like so he must have something! Plus he has a Celtic link! Everyone happy?? Didn't think so!

I am afraid that the CL Qualifiers are to late for me. We should have a new manager in place, within 2 weeks after NL left.
If push come to shove who would you take Coyle or Keane, because that`s how it looks.

HH