Celtic Banter Archive August 23 2012

23 Aug 2012 23:12:49
time for peter lawell to tell us if green has settled debt to celtic as it always seems to be thomson at dundee utd that has the guts to take on green/sevco

Green mentioned paying all clubs by name except Celtic.

WHO CARES?!?!

They are in Divison 3! I could care about the money they owe us. Support your team and enough of the focus on that p!sh.

LINNIE88

POST 2 - what part of all footballing debt in scotland has been paid dont you get? The only reason Dundee Utd werent paid was they requested that the money was deducted from Rangers next TV payment which the SPL and Rangers agreed to.

Jas

23 Aug 2012 14:56:12
Hi Ed

have you seen the clip of the juarez injury?
Jeezo it gave me the boak!
Hope he's gonna be ok!

HH
pfb79 {Ed007's Note - Yeah I have seen it. It looks very nasty.}

23 Aug 2012 14:01:18
Add to that Shaun Maloney was a 4/5th choice CM at Celtic but arguabely kept Wigan up last season and went a long way to secure City the league with hos goal against United.

23 Aug 2012 12:29:26
Am I the Only person who is expecting no transfers in at all? I agree we need a ST and CB and possibly a couple of squad players but I honestly cant see us signing anyone of note. I trust Lawell though, he has ran the club perfectly over the last few years and I trust his judgement.

Sk8

I can see that being the scenario. Tried to point out reasons on here recently as to why it MIGHT happen - but the hard of reading seem to think that means you are HAPPY not to spend and improve the team.
The fact is money is scarce and is more important this season than any. Debt increases if you don'y pay the balance off. Same principle as a credit card. We are in debt. Ki's money (in installments) will 'service' that debt.
Getting this particular side into the Champions League is an achievement in itself. That is our 'next level' so to speak.
We will be even stronger next year - both on and off the park.....................kbt1978

Kbt, explain how we will be stronger next year on park.
we will sign no one this yr, at least one of our quality players will go next yr (probably a good few). At least the P&L will look good though. Dont know if there is a league for that and if you win a trophy. Spare me the debt point. A club our size can manage £7M, its minimal when compared with many other sides. Myself and many fans are monumentally fed up as we see no aspirations to succeed in europe, the lge is a foregone conclusion for next 3-4 years so we need to be focussing on CL/Europa and I mean last 16 not just being happy gettin to group stages. All I see happening is us going backwards and in 4 years when that mob come back we'll be on a level playing field when in reality we should be a million light years ahead of them. Stevo Dundee

I agree. The problem that we have is that there is no guarantee of reaching the group stages of the CL in the next few years. If we start signing expensive players on £25-30k/week on 3 year plus deals, we risk increasing the debt burden significantly if we do not qualify for subsequent CL group stages. Given the financial uncertainty in Scottish football I think we should back Peter Lawwell's judgement in managing Celtic's finances.
Liah Smit

Re: Stevo Dundee

Aspirations to succeed in Europe!?
We have 1 foot in the Champions League with the squad we have. Our young players will improve through the experience. Neil Lennon said we will not need to sell any more next year. Money banked next year.
£7M debt compared with what similar clubs (our size) exactly? Certainly no-one in Scotland where we earn our bread and butter. You cannot compare us to any EPL side due to the difference in TV money.
I would ask you then: What exactly are YOUR aspirations, or more importantly expectations for this season?
CL group stages is a brilliant achievement for me....................... kbt1978

Kbt,
I'm not talking about this season, I'm responding to your original point about next year and being in a better position. I remain at totally different view point as far as that's concerned. As for this year, its great we look like getting to group stage, fingers crossed we get a decent draw and have chance of last 16, More likely we'll be fighting for europa parachute by finishing 3rd. Still great.
"NL said", he also said beginning of this year that there was money to spend until PL told him to change tack and toe the party line so spare me the " we wont sell next yr". Its a given one or more of our stars will be away for a price way under what it should be, as always we'll grab the dough at first opp ( a point backed by others in my earlier posts).
Finally, £7m to a global team our size is manageable. Forget the parameters we live in here in Scotland as far as tv is concerned. We have a billionaire owner, a global fan base, 40k+ ST, etc etc. We just earned £1m for a friendly against RM ffs. Add that to the fee for Ki (staggered payments I know) plus the euro cash and there is absolutely nothing to be concerned about. Dont beleive the "shifting sands" comments coming out of paradise once they've got our ST money. Stevo Dundee

"NL said".................
A lot has changed since the start of the year.............Rangers FFS!
I trust Neil Lennon.
As for 'grabbing the dough', English clubs have bought Scottish and scottish-based players on the cheap for years. Not just Celtic players. They know the League is weak. That will never change. Would we have got £10M for McGeady to England? No chance! £6M more like.
When it comes to the nitty-gritty of club finances we will just have to wait on the financial results being published. I'm confident I will be vindicated in anything I have posted. All I've ever posted is for fellow fans to be realistic in their expectations. I have never said I'm glad or happy not to spend money. Every club side in the world needs strengthening, no team is perfect - not even Barcelona. I only want us to live within our means. Like any other business has to.
I trust my clubs future is safe in the hands of Peter Lawell. As you admit yourself in a post further up you're maybe cynical? If you don't trust PL with your season ticket money then don't give him it.
Its a shame that I seem to keep getting dragged back into posts about players we DON'T have, instead of debating the players we DO have. We have a good young side practically in the CL! It would not surprise me if we are the youngest side in it. They will get better for the experience.
One last sobering thought. The Seville sides' wage bill was 97% of annual turnover (wikipedia). Thats why we are still in debt today. In a couple of years Financial Fair Play kicks in - those figures would not allow that side to play in European competition. We must cut our cloth accordingly, keep winning titles and qualifying for the CL. Easy eh?
No doubt someone will post back "speculate to accumulate" and away we go again!.................hail! hail!...............kbt1978

Kbt, u still don't acknowledge the debt level we have is comfortable for a club this size. As I point out the fee for Ki plus the friendly money wipes it out. As for money being especially tight this yr, how? 40k ST, pretty much guaranteed CL money. Why not invest in the team in the areas we are glaringly short? This team will not get out of group with current bodies. Watch the game again n we cld have been about 3 or 4 down at h/t against a decent strike force. Sorry, but not prepared to accept your argument. Here's a prediction - next June listen to PL tell us about investment in team whilst asking us to buy season tickets! Stevo dundee

I will never acknowledge that any debt is comfortable for our club Stevo.
Certainly not after Rangers crimes and problems. Too many Celtic fans now seem to have developed the same attitude (IMO) as Rangers fans in the 90s 'spend big' 'we demand signings' 'take us to the next level' 'sign from a position of strength' and look what happened!?
Off the top of my head, our profit last year was only £100,000 on a turnover of around £60,000,000 Ed007 I hope can possibly give the exact figures? We are not reducing the debt - merely adding to it and paying off the interest. I'm sure our wage bill was approx £40M a year (again can Ed confirm?). That's why the wage bill needed cut - NOT to 'free up money' for signings but to control the spending.
I am not denying the team could do with strengthening. I watched the game - that's football, we took our chances when they came. That's why we won.
You obviously have extremely optimistic expectations, probably driven more so since rangers demise. Our first attempt in 4 years at CL and you demand last 16?
I am not prepared to accept your argument either. I am a realistic fan and am always looking at the bigger picture. The experience gained from qualifying from the groups THIS season will help us immeasurably next season, to hopefully qualify again. The money earned WILL clear the debt NEXT season. Finishing 3rd
in the group is a realistic target with hopefully a plum tie in the Europa after Xmas to look forward to.
The medium and long term future of the club is far more important to me than signings. If Peter Lawell says we can afford it - great! If not - I trust his judgement. Like i said before - maybe you should stop giving Celtic your hard earned cash if they are not providing the signings you demand. We will agree to disagree..............kbt1978 {Ed007's Note - The pre-tax profit was £177,000 KBT with a turnover of £52,557,000. The wage bill, which has steadily dropped each year, was down to £32.66 million, (it was £38,950,000 in 2008), and is 62% of the turnover (it was only 53.4% in 2008). Over this summer we have lost £92,000 from the weekly wage bill (£4,784,000 p.a.).

Cheers Ed,
So, it would appear then that turnover is decreasing, and therefore the wage bill as a % of that turnover is increasing (despite the wages themselves dropping).
Do you happen to know what the max % ratio of wages to turnover, is the cut-off point for the Financial Fair Play Rules that are coming? I'm sure it was 58% to 60%. When exactly are these rules expected to come in?...............kbt1978 {Ed007's Note - The FFP rules say that club's employee benefits expenses (wages, bonuses etc) should not exceed 70% of their total revenue. In the EPL the teams with the lowest percentage going on wages are Man Utd (46%) and Arsenal (48%), Man City are the highest (114%) and Aston Villa (90%), Chelsea are at 85%. This season is the first season to be taken into account regarding the 2014-15 assessment.}

23 Aug 2012 09:01:07
Mr Regan and his talk of league
reconstruction is a joke. The bending
of rules to accommodate Newco is
nothing more than I expected from
the SFA and their rangers minded
members. Is Ogilvie still there?

Im sure Doncaster is on record,from a couple of years ago,as saying it would never happen.It is staggering the amount of pro The rangers nonsense thats around..........green jhedi

Rangers fan here and I hope nothing changes next season. I do not want people saying league reconstruction is to suit Rangers. We were badly run built up huge debts and were liquidated as a result. We have started in the third division where we should stay and the majority of our fans want allowing us to work our way through the divisions then change by all means.
Is it not because Scottish football is in a state, look at Ki for example a good player by far better than Steven Fletcher yet his transfer fee is almost three times more? Also a professional footballer will leave a team on the verge of Champions league, guaranteed medals for what a team who are likely to face a relegation battle but will still earn more than Scottish football combined.
That is what Scottish football and the players have become and both Glasgow teams are what has kept it afloat until now.
Change is needed but not in our name please!

Can't argue with that...col

A very fair point gers man..........green jhedi

Rangers fan...you are so right.....and you are welcome on this page as long as you continue to make sensible statements like this (but if ye decide to get cheeky at a later date then we'll be less accomodating! lol)

Hail Hail
ChrisBhoy

The reasons you list "Rangers fan" are exactly why League reconstruction is necessary.It has nothing to do with accomadating any one club,never mind Rangers. Scottish football WAS in a poor state for years before RFC's problems.
It is an obvious requirement that our game needs change as you have stated and recognised. Please cancel your subscription to the latest "Thimmy" propaganda campaign.
You are entitled to your opinion mate but spare me the "Not in OUR name" chaff because the theory is utter B/S.
Don't believe me? Look at how many agrees and posts you got from CFC fans.
P.O.B.