Celtic Banter Archive February 15 2019

 

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15 Feb 2019 17:31:42
Arsenal fans were blinded by pure loyalty after the invincible season they didn't realise they went backwards year after year after this. By the time they did realise it was too late.
BR is not irreplaceable! If you ask me, his heart doesn't seem to be 100% in it anymore anyway.
Stevie Clarke for me a the end of the season, Treble treble or not.

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15 Feb 2019 17:51:18
Us going backwards would be only winning the doublešŸ˜‰.

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15 Feb 2019 18:19:19
Nonsense joeshmo, we're not going backwards the rich are just getting richer. Think I heard that the Valencia squad last night cost 140 million and ours cost 25 million, that's the difference, even if we had the 115 million to make up the shortfall players at that level won't come to Scotland. I find it astonishing that fans expect us to compete with clubs that can outspend us 10 fold. Football has changed dramatically for the worst in the last 5 or 6 years by TV and sugar daddies throwing cash at the big 4 leagues.

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15 Feb 2019 20:25:12
When we play in Europe I think we need to find a way of playing that makes us a lot harder to beat.
We hardly ever play a home leg in European competition without conceding, we don't give ourselves a chance.
I'm not saying that we should park the bus, but tactically we have to be a lot more streetwise.
I accept that the likes of Valencia will always pose a threat, but we are losing goals at home to the likes of Rosenberg and AEK Athens.
I like watching the football we play domestically, but we have to accept that European teams are of a far higher standard than those in Scotland. At home we can give the ball away and win it back almost immediately, whereas in Europe when we lose the ball it can lead to a goal being scored against us.
Rather than hope that our players don't make errors, I think that Rodgers should accept the fact that they will, we then may be able to find a way of stopping a lot of the soft goals we keep conceding.

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15 Feb 2019 20:38:54
Stevie what was different in Scotland when Henrik Sutton hartson petrov gazza van bronkhurst de boers all came to Scotland quiet simply money not the league, as for being outspent 10 fold apart from the elite teams in the big leagues or the e. p. l. Very few teams can actually outspent Celtic who are officially in the top 40 in world football, last season as an example Valencia made 18 mill less than us and Salzburg don't come close yet both played us off the park, it's not the money it's how we spend it or rather how we don't do you really think it acceptable to go into euro with a team half full of loans or with players running down their contracts with no centre forward an aging left back and a novice to the position leading the attack, you seem to forget we have what you term a sugar daddy only thing he's as tight as a ducks ar*e and if you think any different, think about this if in the last 10 years you bought 1celtic view than you have put more money into the club than he has.

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15 Feb 2019 20:54:56
Gerry and Connolly are right.

Money helps but it's not the be all and end all and if any fans should know that it's ours.

We have been there and got respectable results and performances before so what's stopping us now?

Excuses is what it is. Teams with less than us have outdone us in recent years, so how does that work if it's all just cash?

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15 Feb 2019 21:02:56
All this talk of financial differences is rubbish, these financial differences are in the most cases the result of over inflated transfer fees and are meaningless, last night's game should be looked in the same light as the last game at Ibrox, the team played badly because, players weren't, in some cases, played in their most effective positions, the best team is being changed to accommodate Brown, Izzy was asked to come in and play, and looked short of match sharpness, how are players, who aren't playing in the first kept sharp?, do they play with the younger teams or do they just play matches in training?, KT was a big miss, Izzy should have been playing regularly or Hayes, one of them should have been playing as much as possible, since KT got injured, this chopping and changing is not a good idea.

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15 Feb 2019 21:44:38
Connolly things have changed dramatically since the days of Sutton Hartson and Henrik, in those days we could match or even better clubs in England and the continent's wages, in those days 30 grand a week was a very good wage in the premiership in England and we could match it, it's when the new tv deals and rich Arabs came in and started throwing 60 grand a week at 17 year olds and 100-200 grand a week at the equivalent of your Sutton and Larssons.

A big chunk of our income comes from Season ticket sales and I'm sure back in the early 2000s I was paying not much less for my season ticket than I do now, the club's revenue is not much more now than it was back in the early 2000s which means we can still only pay wages up to around 30 grand a week, unfortunately for 30 grand a week nowadays you don't get proven quality.

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15 Feb 2019 21:57:06
Aindoh financial differences are not rubbish, look at every league in Europe and you"ll find league positions at end of the season is determined by wealth in England you can as good as name the top 6 at the beginning of the season, the 2 Manchester clubs, Liverpool, Chelsea Arsenal and Tottenham, it's no coincidence they are the biggest spenders also. Italy Germany and Spain is the same. Us in Scotland are the biggest spenders hence 7 titles in a row and a double treble. Money is the most important thing in modern day football whereas in the past there was a more level playing field.

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15 Feb 2019 22:13:46
Fair enough Stevie, so if financial differences are so important, then why canā€™t we complete with Valencia, who as you read earlier, spent 18m less than us last year. Why did Bate beat Arsenal last night and why are the zombies breathing down our neck.
Money helps, but it means nothing if you donā€™t spend it right.

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15 Feb 2019 22:54:56
Joeshmo, Valencia made 18 million less than us last year not spent. I would imagine this figure is worked out through gate money, merchandise and European participation. The huge part that has been missed here is the millions they would of received from La liga tv deal and whatever there billionaire owner pumped in. Do you think they could assemble a squad at a cost of 140 million with a turnover of 80 million? Bate probably beat Arsenal last night for the same reason we beat Leipzig, played well on the night. Do you think Bate will go through? I doubt it. As for the Zombies breathing down our necks šŸ˜‚šŸ˜‚ you're having a laugh. They maybe should be as they have probably spent as much as us if not more over the last couple of years ( money they don't have aswell)

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15 Feb 2019 22:58:39
What's financial differences got to do with not being able to pass the ball to a team mate, you don't understand what I mean if you think I mean St Mirren are meant to compete with Celtic, I don't mean that, I mean you lot are bringing up how much Valencia's team are 'worth', that 'worth' is meaningless, because of the crazy money paid in transfer fees, Celtic didn't lose because Valencia had better player, Valencia won because their players played better.

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15 Feb 2019 23:47:58
Tactics and management will take you further than money.

Ferguson beat Real Madrid with Aberdeen and won the Scottish League then took Man Utd to their modern heights.

Stevie Clark at Killie on a nothing budget.

Yes money is a huge help and wages are ridiculous but mostly that's in England and the highest end clubs in la Liga etc

Which is nothing different from anytime in history. The best players always played there so nothing changed.

We can still compete with teams from the likes of Holland and Portugal etc in the market. Shop in they markets.

Plenty of talented players around if yer willing to pay the right price.

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16 Feb 2019 01:07:59
Where is this pish about them spending Ā£18M less than us coming from. They mustā€™ve spent ā‚¬75M easy last year. They spent about ā‚¬16M on Gameira and about ā‚¬6M on Wass and Kondogbia was about ā‚¬25M, Piccini ā‚¬10M, Diakhaby ā‚¬15M. Half of the balloons on here just seem to make it up as they go.

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16 Feb 2019 02:41:20
Wowwww! Some talk about getting rid of Rodgers lol not saying heā€™s not replaceable. But heā€™s brought us nothing but glory over these last few season champions league football 2 seasons in a row and in Europa 2s, invincible season. Double treble going for treble treble. Itā€™s not Rodgers kicking the ball all heā€™s doing is telling his team how to try and play. Maybe sometimes itā€™s wrong tactics to go for against superior teams, but itā€™s his style and he will stick tell it wether use like it or not. I do believe on European nights we should switch it up abit. Next week hopefully a more attacking team, theirs sweet FA to lose anyway may aswell go for it. A we early goal would hopefully make it a match and if we lose hopefully we go out with abit of class a lot more creativity and making them work a lot harder for it, ino our away record is terrible. Itā€™s our religion to believe no matter what.

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16 Feb 2019 07:02:16
Steve Clarke would be a backwards step for us. What a shambles that would be if we dropped Brendan for him. Yes he is doing a great job at Killie but we should be aiming far far higher than that. Even championship teams seem to be bringing in high class managers. Wolves a prime example a couple season back brining in Nino EspĆ­rito Santo. Reason he made such great signings form Portugal is due to his knowledge of those players and links to all those clubs and there agents. Bielsa at Leeds is also a higher quality manager than a team like Leeds. Look what heā€™s done with the players at his disposal. We can aim higher than Rodgers and I believe we will. But during his time here letā€™s embrace the fact that we have a top class manager right now. Funny how our whole fan base breaks down after we get beat off of one of the top teams in Spanish football. Get a grip.

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16 Feb 2019 08:57:21
Back in 2007 we played AC Milan in the last 16.We drew 0-0 at home and took the game into extra time. Kaka scored the winner. We competed over the 2 legs with sheer grit and determination. We where up against player like Pirlo, Kaka, Seedorf, Inzaghi, Dida, Maldini. We had the likes of Nayler, O'Dea, Beattie, Telfer. We punched well above our weight against one of the best. The financial differences where huge then. Gutted we lost but had a great night with all the Milan fans.

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15 Feb 2019 16:20:04
EF me everyone Scot brown Izzy no legs anymore the passing with them two so bad the pass backs shocking we need to stop this like a year ago. Brown. Issy gf enough for scottish that's it. We spent 50% of the game passing back or to the sides I'm sick if it we where getting beat we should be going forward constantly as this makes teams pull back. But Celtic where predictable we are a gd team going forward Rodgers said a Few months ago he's trying to stop this but it's the same 3 person's either go back the or to the side and put us under pressure all the pressure last night was our own fault we did stop this but the usual suspects keep doing it. I got one did not want brown to stay he's a crab wayword passes slow stops our intensity constantly and let's teams come at us. Issy is done es not the Issy off old in Europe those two kept slowing the game down when we where getting beat by not going forward. we wasted half the game pissing about at the back that team where quick Rodgers new this we gave the game to them and not enough pressure we messed around. I think if we attack we go through but I'm a Celtic fan I never ever expected to get beat. Rodgers said he does not tell them to mess around in defence it's like our defenders lost there nerve. Soz for the rant
andy.

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15 Feb 2019 20:53:17
Joe away and play tig on the mate.

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15 Feb 2019 14:35:10
The expectation levels of some of our support is staggering.
They had whipped themselves up into thinking beating Airdrie, st mirren and st Johnstone ment that the pumping of Valencia was a formality.
In reality we haven't had a gd transfer window in recent years therefore our level is domestic dominance and a hope and a prayer when it comes to Europe.
The players brought in at January should be enough to clinch the title but with kt bencovic and rogic out and eddy not fully fit the Valencia game was always going to be difficult.
The summer is were the club have no choice but to invest due to the end of loan players and contacts coming to a finish.
Then will be the time to judge if our club are serious about having designs on acting like the big club they always claimto be or if they are simply just trying to stay a few steps ahead of our domestic competition.
Gone are the days of hoping to buy a squad of 1 to 2million pound players and developing them into a European outfit.
If we want sustained revenue from the champions League then decent but realistic money has to be invested to give us the best chance of that happening.
If that doesn't happen then we will all need to get used to Europe as being a bonus and not a playground were we can genuinely compete.

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15 Feb 2019 15:55:55
I have said on here a few times that domestic dominance is our main priority and Europe is a bonus and it really is a very successful and record-breaking time for our club during this time.
However, we do appreciate European football and have great memories of some brilliant nights at Celtic Park facing up to top class teams and taking a few scalps under WGS and NL.
Unfortunately, in recent years the cream of Europe have become even stronger and much more rich with the way the tournaments are 'fixed', but it's not so long ago we drew twice with Man City, beat Anderlecht away and won very important home ties against Zenit and Leipzig - so we can still compete - as long as we eventually learn to cut out stupid mistakes and lose the fear.
Last night's side was a few short of our best 11 and I think, with quality additions (and a clear-out) in the summer we can improve.
In the meantime, back to league business and sights on Killie.

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15 Feb 2019 16:22:42
I have said on here before that attracting the quality of player, to what is effectively a one horse league, needed to take us to the next level in terms of europe is extremely difficult unless we can offer champions league football. To be able to offer champions league football we have to negoiate 4 qualifiers first. That is no fault of the board.

It depends on how you define a big club? In terms of facilities, fan base, honours won then yes we are a big club but in terms of finances then no we are not a big club.

The situation is what it is in that we have to do our best to get through the qualifiers in order to be able to attract a better quality of player. We have a sound buisness model in place which will keep the club in a healthy position with or without Champions League revenue.

Nights like last night and others this season will only benefit our young squad, yes it's a harsh footballing lesson but a lesson learned and a good education, add to that the winning of plenty of domestic honours, we're on the right trackšŸ‘.

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15 Feb 2019 16:40:07
Oab. this window quality signings and a clear out. groundhog day. worst thing about Thurs was Valencia wouldn't make the top 40 of teams I've seen us play in Europe. we again beat ourselves or allowed ourselves to be beat easily by an ok team . terrible passing stupid mistake players not performing.

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16 Feb 2019 08:58:33
I can understand all your point of views about financial benefits in football, and of course we're all devastated and thought things were going to play out a bit different, but it hasnā€™t. So get over it, we still have plenty to offer domestically. And I know Iā€™m just being naive, but itā€™s never over tell the fat lady sings. I myself donā€™t reckon we'll qualify, but I wonā€™t lose hope. I just think if we get an early goal then itā€™s game on! You are obviously thinking if we couldnā€™t score a goal at home we're never going to score away.

But we'll never know until next week. Let the next 90 minutes do the talking we have nothing to lose. And as the saying goes, the one's with nothing to lose are the most dangerous. After writing all this i didnā€™t know whether I was going to post it. Up the celts! We'll love them till we die, no matter what happens.

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15 Feb 2019 13:46:36
Trying to recall another team playing it about inside 2 yards, so as to rely upon sliding challenges from the goalie, back and forth across the goalline. Is this Brendan's innovation? Hard to imagine the circumstances under which it could inspire much confidence.

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15 Feb 2019 14:17:40
Think that was because there was no midfielder making themselves available to come and take the ball and drive forward with it, McGregor should be in Browns position.

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15 Feb 2019 14:34:49
They did seem to play part of the game at least in each other's accustomed roles Aindoh, or so I thought. But yeah I guess that partly explains it. Very odd to see!

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15 Feb 2019 16:24:35
The midfield offered nothing at all aindoh you're right there. Sinclair came deep a few times but apart from that, nada. Brown and both full backs need to be a lot better on the ball playing it from the back as well mind. I was personally thinking Brown might get hooked at half time, or at the very least get CalMac alongside him as another option, and one who looks better on the turn.

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15 Feb 2019 13:29:11
Usually after a european defeat my ex bear pals gleefully get in touch to tell me how much they won.
Right on cue about 30 minutes ago both of them and the "returning suit" emailed me boasting they all won "substantial amounts" my two ex bears were more coy about their winnings but not the suit, he can never be accused of hiding his light under a bushel and gleefully informed he he put on Ā£1000 at 11/ 10 so made an Ā£1100 profit. Ach well maybe I will try and entice all 3 into more bets lol.

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15 Feb 2019 14:13:22
Whatā€™s the point, the wife wonā€™t let you!

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15 Feb 2019 17:54:06
Daftabet I'm genuinely shocked to see you on here after Celtic got beatšŸ˜†.

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15 Feb 2019 13:16:01
Liked most of our good ladies on Valentines day and the people with their sisters. We got well and truly pumped. Hopefully they all bounce back for the weekend.

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15 Feb 2019 21:40:12
I hope all the beautiful girls had a wonderful valentines day. To all the fat birds out there. Chin up it's pancake day next week!

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15 Feb 2019 13:12:31
So another Euro game passes us by. but. We gave them the goals by visiting our old friend concentration. First Izzy, is, as usual, two or three yards behind the CB's who bring the line out. Second, he must tuck in, Jozo has to cover in case Boyata gets skinned, so he MUST follow the man. Concentration.

Without labouring any points, we still look unsure at this level. Even starting well, first ten to fifteen was very promising, we let them step into the game by slackness in our own passing. These teams will hurt you, but we seem to shoot ourselves in the foot consistently.

Positives? Europe looks done so power on and win the lot again. If we play as we can we will be fine domestically. tricky games coming up and we must win them, that nightmare at Kilmarnock especially. Overall a kick in the goolies but we must respond.

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14 Feb 2019 22:16:22
Ed what's your take on the game? šŸ€.

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{Ed007's Note - It confirmed what we already knew, squad players like Izaguirre, Jozo, and Boyata who has ideas well above his station aren't good enough at that level. Christie looked lost but he can only get better in the coming years and Burke will do a turn up front in the SPFL but he's not ready to play there in Europe and Scott Brown played last night like he was earlier in the season, the game just seemed to pass him by and he never got near their midfield all night.
It would have made a huge difference if KT and Benkovic had been fit imo.}

15 Feb 2019 12:32:31
I think the team lack a genuine belief that they can beat quality teams and the only way to change that is by actually doing it. The Leipzig performance and result should have inspired them but it doesn't seem to have done that.

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15 Feb 2019 13:12:32
Totally agree Brown and Izziguirre were woeful and Boyata must look in mirror and see a different player from the one we all see of him, ie Sh! te.
On the plus side, maybe West Brom will let us have Burke next season as well, on last night's display he was poor also.

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15 Feb 2019 13:39:42
I thought they got to Brown. Saw him niggling at them and remonstrating and figured they just decided to bam him up a bit. Could be wrong.

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15 Feb 2019 15:32:18
Izzy is def done at that level ed and the players u mentioned a said on another thread that Christie was non existent he looked way short and Burke is not a no 9 his mentor at Forrest said when he signed he's a winger and nothng else although he'll get away with it in spl.

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15 Feb 2019 11:00:47
"Lord grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can, And the wisdom to know the difference"
I agree to some extent with everything that has been said on here after the match but I think the wisdom of the serenity prayer needs to be applied. No amount of money spent is going to create a team that can genuinely compete at this level whilst we compete in Scotland. The English Championship can pay higher wages and even if we could afford their wages the better players don't want to come here. It is useless howling at the moon. We do not have the power to change this.
What can we change? I believe we have a very, very good manager and i don't believe we would be celebrating a double treble or invincible year or be hopeful for a treble treble this year without him at the helm. BR maybe needs to change tactics according who we are playing. Playing the ball out from the back is a very good policy as hoofing it up the park is 50/ 50 who ends up with it. However we have seen in the league with lesser competition that if the put in the effort and press us high it is possible to beat us. I mean if a team like hearts can beat us 4-0 with high pressing who should be surprised that Valencia beat us 2-0 Last night we were punished for a couple of errors but I can think of another 2 or 3 in our area that could easily have been punished. I honestly believe that at times we need to defend in 10 and boot the ball up the pitch if we are to have a chance of beating better opposition, win ugly rather than lose because when I think of playing the Celtic Way that does not include losing.

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15 Feb 2019 11:22:44
We all want the team to improve and be more competitive in Europe, but we will never be more than we are at the moment if we revert to 1980s Wimbledon long ball tactics every time we come up against a team we think are better. We would not get better results either this way as you don't automatically "win ugly" just because you put 10 men behind the ball. Good European teams will more often than not rip that system to pieces.
These players need to experience trying to play their own game against the best opposition possible so that we improve our football style over time, and I think we can play good football on our day against all but the very very best teams.

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15 Feb 2019 14:13:49
Two good posts. I agree with IOG that we shouldnā€™t change our tactics though. It might get the odd result in the short term but longer term, we need to stick to the plan and try a develop a game to complete. Bottom line is, we played a team that was assembled with Ā£150M and they looked every bit a Ā£150M team. We just need to deal with it.

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16 Feb 2019 10:56:37
Thank you Isleofgreen and COYBIG for your replies you have convinced me in that I was wrong in latter part of post in that changing tactics against superior opposition is not the solution but rather practice and experience so as to cut out stupid errors. Unfortunately playing in Scotland we will get neither.

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15 Feb 2019 09:46:48
Another night of abject failure in Europe, as good as Brendan has been domestically in Europe it's been pretty dire. Valencia are decent but nothing special and after 2nd goal we had no ideas. Ā£38 million in the bank yet we just need to accept loans here and there, edouard was basically paid for by Armstrong leaving. Mabye good enough to win another title but if Celtic are ever going to be as big as we want them to be then maybe we should speculate to accumulate a little, not talking about going the sevco route but if dermot is the billionaire we are told he is then why not spend some of it otherwise why is he here? the fans fund Celtic.

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15 Feb 2019 10:27:05
Yeah he has been terrible in Europe.

Only managed to get to CL group stages 2 times out of 3 and only managed to get European football after Xmas 2 times out of 3.

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15 Feb 2019 11:09:06
I agree RAW it's very unfair to say that's a terrible European record.
We have more potential than we are showing but we're not a million miles away from having a team that gets better results more often in Europe. Realistically success for me would be regularly finishing 3rd in our CL group with at least 6 points and reaching the last 16 of the EL.
Desmond is a shareholder and wants the club to be self sustaining, the reason he is a billionaire is because the companies he is involved in are profitable by themselves.

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15 Feb 2019 11:47:37
The club is self sustaining because the fans pump millions into the club, its great to see us with cash in bank and secure but do we just want to be in Europe to make up the numbers or try make an impact? If we had a few million or nothing in reserve I would understand caution but for Lawwell to say the club is in best ever financial position then sign guys on loan for a few months is a bit of a slap in the face to us. The club has several celebrity FANS but truth being told only folk who pump money into our club is the fans like all of us on these pages who care enough to get the cash register going.

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15 Feb 2019 12:35:04
Outside of qualification our best European performances came against Man City and Bayern. We won neither.

Leipzig was ok but we were terrible the rest of the Europa

Zenit was ok then the second leg was horrible.

Brendans record in Europe even with the English money was shocking.

I made a post in here about BATE a while back. A squad that cost 200k and do as good as us in Europe over the last 7 or 8 years.

So I'm sick hearing the money excuse or th quality that we can't do anything. Man up and stop making excuses.

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15 Feb 2019 18:01:22
I would disagree as I thought our best performance was against anderlecht away from home.

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15 Feb 2019 20:22:33
Anderlecht just sacked their manager as they were struggling badly in Belgian league

Once new manager stabilised them they dominated us at parkhead.

Sad truth behind that story.

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15 Feb 2019 09:44:05
Never thought Iā€™d say this, but, even with the domestic dominance weā€™re going backwards. It really isnā€™t going to take much more signings by another team to overtake us.
Playing a passing game from the back with players who are incapable of doing it lands firmly at the managers door. Bain constantly putting us under pressure with needles passes then suddenly weā€™ve put it out for a throw at our own 18 yard box. I donā€™t blame Bain, heā€™s been told to play this way, even the times he did go long, he will probably get a roasting from the manager for it.
Loans, projects, thatā€™s all we hear these days, I honestly wouldnā€™t care if Rodgers left at end of season and we got Clarke in.

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15 Feb 2019 10:16:41
This passing from the goalkeeper is ok for players who are good enough to do it, Rodgers is stubborn though and was same with Liverpool. He has done a great job domestically but Europe is dire and he may well have taken us as far as he thinks he can as Celtic will never spend what it takes to make that step up.

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15 Feb 2019 12:16:00
If BR can't take us further then who can? Name a manager better than him that would actually come to celtic.

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15 Feb 2019 17:24:29
Not saying better manager but would take Steve Clarke. Personally I want BR to stay as what he has given us the fans since day one is record after record and trophy after trophy. He has given us European nights even though some bitterly disappointing other nights have been unforgettably memorable. Football is about highs and lows. Maybe some on here haven't experienced the lows some others know all too well.

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16 Feb 2019 01:24:09
If you read my post carefully you might get it, I didnā€™t say anyone else would do better than Brendan but he might think he has taken us as far as he can within the budget he has to work with. He has done a great job domestically but clearly canā€™t progress us in Europe and this could make him walk. Ok is that clear enough.

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16 Feb 2019 08:56:14
Kwaj, as a season ticket holder since the days of Brady and macari Iā€™ve experienced highs and lows.

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15 Feb 2019 09:34:44
Our fan base is quite funny. Expecting way too much from the squad we have got, to beat a well organised Valencia team. This was never going to be an easy game. This Valencia team beat Manchester United. We need to get behind the squad now. We have a treble treble to win. And have more important fixtures coming up in the coming weeks.

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15 Feb 2019 10:30:20
Exactly.

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15 Feb 2019 08:38:13
They have a player at Ā£40 million.
If only they brought in a system where clubs had to be run on the revenue they generate and not on what personal funds billionaires pump into their "hobby" clubs.
Of course we would need appropriate punishments to deter big clubs from breaking the rules.
It would help make it a wee bit more of an even playing field.
We could call it something like Financial Fair Play or. oh wait!

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15 Feb 2019 09:53:00
It shows where we are when they've got a sub that cost 40 mill and we're expected to compete it's not a level playing field.

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{Ed001's Note - you have how much in the bank? How much has been taken out in dividends? You could easily spend that kind of money if you didn't take so many loans that cost large sums for little return. Valencia do not have much more money than Celtic, but they just put all their income into building a football team, Celtic spend most of theirs on building fortunes for those with shares.}

15 Feb 2019 10:18:19
We had a Ā£20m player with Dembele (who will go for more if and when the time comes) and apparently a Ā£75m player in VVD?
I appreciate what you are saying and European football is full of clubs that can spend outwith their means because of billionaire owners and corporations that use the clubs as a money pit.
Player valuations and transfer fees have gone crazy and although there are several 'world class' players possibly worth the money, there are far too many over-rated and vastly overpriced good ones.

In the past we have always come up against far richer and better teams in Europe, but made Celtic Park a fortress, with sheer effort, passion - plus what skill, flair and craft we had at the club at that particular time - and it worked.
These days we have become a soft-touch even at home because of a fear and nervousness that comes from a lack of confidence and an awareness of our own glaring deficiencies in key positions.
The defense was make-shift to say the least, with a player who doesn't want to be here, a left back past his best and a loanee RB trying his best to fit into a new team.
The absence of KT and Benkovic (another loan) was a huge loss and with the team playing without a proper front-man/ striker we were unable to hold-up/ keep the ball the way every other team can do.
These personnel and tactical gaps have been an issue for a wee while now and until the manager addresses this and strengthens the spine of the team with the quality we need, it will continue.
As will the defeats if he never learns from them.
At present, I have all but written off Europe in the comfort of our domestic displays and continued success, but I would like us to use the summer window to bring in permanent solutions?

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15 Feb 2019 10:18:44
Way out our depth last night. Valencia are a bang average European team but on another level compared to us. We were back to being a mess at the back, couldn't pass to a green and white jersey and no creativity. Maybe Rodgers has taken this as far as he can in europe, his tactics and team selection brought into question again! Surely Hayes would be better at LB than Izzy.

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15 Feb 2019 10:42:04
A saw that ed but we don't have the revenue or income to sustain a spending spree on a par with those teams the money the Spanish teams generate is far greater we have 38 mill cash in the bank they had a 40 mill player on the bench plus an array of talent never mind 3 star players at home.

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{Ed001's Note - but you do have the revenue and income to sustain spending on the same level as Valencia. While they are a huge club in Spain, they have not managed their club as financially soundly as Celtic have. You have had years of money going outside of football, to directors and shareholders, that should have been invested in the team. That is why you are behind and will continue to fall further behind until that changes. You are in the same situation as Newcastle. There the owner takes money out and then claims that the club can't afford to sustain more spending. Both of you could quite easily invest more if less was disappearing into people's pockets!}

15 Feb 2019 12:20:10
Are you saying the dividends have been very excessive Ed?

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{Ed001's Note - not really, just saying you can't compete while money is going out of the club. You can compete as a self-financing club, but that requires all the money to be re-invested.}

15 Feb 2019 08:34:50
Tippy tappy football is nice when you are in command. It also helps if you pass the ball to your own player and not give it to an opposing player. However, there is also a time for blootering the ball clear and we failed there as well too many times.
For me, only Sinclair, Forest and Bain could get a pass mark on last night's performance. Bain could not be faulted for the goals but Emilio is a yard too slow at this level and both goals where partially due to him being unable to keep up with the attacker who had a free run at the ball.
As for the elbow job - we were fortunate to finish game with 11 players as WE would have been screaming for a red card.
That said, Forest definitely denied at least one penalty.
Better team won on the night and the difference in quality showed imo.

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15 Feb 2019 10:21:35
McGregor was very good, but had to fall back more to cover Broony, who was making a lot of mistakes and being caught out too often.
Broony has been immense since the January break, but I think he burned himself out after a very busy and buzzing start and found the quality and pace of a better opponent a wee bit to much.

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15 Feb 2019 08:21:04
It looked like we got spooked scared passess leads to negative play when we did get at them with Forrest running at them showed them up but we didnā€™t do that often enough. Bad night at the office move on another tough game on Sunday need to recover dust themselves down and start again.

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15 Feb 2019 07:35:42
Last night performance again in Europe was dire to say the least. I've slaughtered Sinclair on here at times but he was by far our best player last night yet BR saw fit to whip him off? On the other side we had Forrest who up until maybe the 70th minute hardly touched the ball. Could we not maybe have took Forrest of instead and pushed Burke wide and still bring in edouard and left Sinclair on? Also the tactics in Europe need addressed. We're trying to play the same way as we do domestically, against better opposition and getting punished big time. How many times last night was the ball going too and fro across the back line, going from Bain to brown and back again, almost getting caught out on a few occasions totally inviting pressure onto ourselves. This at that level needs to change, we don't have the personnel with the quality to carry that style out in Europe and the results since Brendan's cane in prices this. I've said it time and again, we've a massive job in the summer sorting that defence out and to be in a situation in any window where we're needing possibly 6/ 7 signings is not good enough. From the financial position and winning situation we're in the past 7 years we should be making 2/ 3 quality additions each window not needing to sign 5/ 6/ 7 players.

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15 Feb 2019 09:57:20
Good post garry thatt would have been my shout or just take Burke off and leave Forrest because he had started getting past them but Burke was way off it he might get away with playing no9 in Scottish game but not at that level he hardly showed for the ball and av no idea what Christie was doing he hardly touched either.

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15 Feb 2019 13:00:17
Christie last night was way out his depth for me mally. Definitely a player there and with experience should progress but not yet at that level. Itā€™s so frustrating, I get Valencia are in a better league, more expensive players etc but I just feel yet again we failed to compete. For me I always thought weā€™d go out this round, mainly down to our away record in Europe but really thought we couldā€™ve won that game last night maybe a 2-1 or so but it just didnā€™t look like we competed, on top of that weā€™ve players that couldnā€™t pas a ball 10 yards at times without finding an opposition player, and this passing across the back then back again, at least twice I can remember last night us nearly being caught out by our own messing about. We can do that domestically but not in Europe against quality opposition, we inevitably get punished, so frustrating mate.

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15 Feb 2019 00:48:18
The main problem in Europe under BR definitely looks like mentality rather than ability. The first 10 to 15 showed that we can take the game to them and impose ourselves but they just fell apart after that.

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15 Feb 2019 01:57:09
No exactly true.

Seen the same thing Lennon era vs Juventus

AEK this year

Now Valencia.

These teams play defensive strict tactical football and aim to counter

Simply having the possession means not a lot in this scenario, a few half chances.

They controlled us tonight without the ball and closed all our passing lanes and we had no plan B.

We need a target man and a new style.

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15 Feb 2019 07:51:01
The midfield was lacking last night, remember when Brown was out injured and the whole way the team played changed for the better, just saying,

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15 Feb 2019 09:11:03
We did look better. However it's like the rangers results. People rightly went mental and pointed out our issues.

But a few loan signings and wins Vs st Johnstone etc and we are world beaters again.

Same with the musonda loan last year.

People actually thought we could beat beat valencia.

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15 Feb 2019 12:25:40
If we don't think we have a chance at home against Valencia then we may as well pack it in. They're a good team but so are we and there was a positive result for the taking last night IMO.

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15 Feb 2019 20:24:48
We should have a chance but we just don't nowadays.

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15 Feb 2019 00:45:18
3 up front last 20 mins and we still tippy tappy rubbish why donā€™t we just launch it and have a go Raging at that.

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15 Feb 2019 01:58:14
Nobody to launch it to unfortunately. Rodgers is like Wenger and never changes style.

We don't really have the players to change style.

Football equivalent of putting all your eggs in one basket.

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15 Feb 2019 08:43:02
Quite a few times this season when we have dropped points, we have failed to score.
St. Mirren, Livingston, Hearts, Hibs and sevco.
In these games we could have played all night and not scored.
In future if we canā€™t score in the first 80 minutes, I would go route one and mix it up a little, even if it means we put Boyata up to knock the balls into more dangerous areas.
Our problem is other teams know we are going to play the same way for 90 minutes.
I remember in the St. Mirren match we managed to play the long ball for the first time in injury time and Leigh scored, only to be offside, he was in loads of space and If we had only tried it sooner we would have won. We need to try plan B.

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